new here (kind of) :)

hello all :)
i've been a silent member here (under a different nick) for quite a while, but i never posted... i am so glad this community is here, and i want to say that i think you are a wonderful, supportive, caring group of people... even though i never posted, i got very much advice from reading other peoples' posts... however, i've recently gotten seriously involved with an older man, and am in need of advice myself...
i am a 19 year old female, very much in love with a 40 year old male... i moved from colorado to go to college where he is (my parents don't know about him, so they think i moved just for school) we have now been living together for almost a month...
we are very much in love, and planning on getting married (first at an arts festival in nevada in september, and more formally as soon as my parents know about him)...
we both have part-time, low-paying jobs, so we are doing alright... my parents are actually paying my/our rent, so that helps a lot...
but anyway, on my first day of my new job last week, my guy came to pick me up... a co-worker said (more than once) that my "dad or uncle is here to pick me up"... i told my guy about it, and we both kinda laughed and joked about it for a while... but i think it bothered him some, and i guess it kinda bothered me... i know that this is likely to happen more than once, but i guess i never really thought he looked as old as he is... has anyone experienced similar things? and is it easier to deal with the second time?
thanks so much for your time, and thanks in advance for any advice/stories anyone is willing to share :)
thanks...
peace,
kd

hi and welcome to ageless, i'm glad you found us.

good luck with your relationship, and don't let the age get in the way of your feelings for each other. try not to let other people's comments get to you.

the only thing that concerns me is that your parents are in the dark about this. have you thought about telling them, what do you think their reaction would be?

my parents are paying my rent too. i only bring this up because i live with my brother, and his girlfriend was staying here a lot a few months ago. when our mom found that out she was pretty mad, since she was unknowingly helping to foot the bill for something that she morally does not support (living together before marriage). i didn't care as long as she cleaned up after herself...well she is pretty messy so i guess i did have a problem with it.

anyway, best wishes to you, and be sure to keep us posted!

Hey there, kdk,

The fact that people would automatically assume that your bf was your uncle or your dad simply because he is 20 + years older than you only displays how ageist and ignorant our society is regarding this type of relationship, even though it's quite likely that those people didn't mean any offense. Until age disparate relationships are respected and accepted as much as interracial and homosexual relationships, people will continue to make the type of ignorant assumptions (i.e., that a 40 yr old man couldn't possibly be a romantic partner of yours) that your co-workers have.
Also, I think it's wonderful that a cool YW like you can make such a good relationship partner to an OM. Too many people will make rude ageist remarks when they would see me dating a woman your age, insisting that only an OW could be a viable relationship partner to an OM, have the same interests, etc. And yes, many YW out there do indeed have emotions that are constantly in flux and are terribly unstable, and would not make good relationship partners...but your bf obviously knows that you are as interested in love as you are in having fun, and has interests in common with you. Many OM (myself included) have social interests and emotional needs that are more in harmony with YW, just waiting to meet one who is serious about love. Just because you are "only" 19 doesn't mean that you should be assumed "too immature" for love, because that is a highly individual thing. You should be judged only by your actions, not by the mere fact of your age (that is no better than making a presumptive judgment about someone based solely upon their race or gender).
Hence...both of you have a good thing going here, so don't worry overly much about the ignorance of others. It's their responsibility to learn to be more sensitive to the fact that not everyone dates and loves based upon some sort of universal cultural blueprint, so that they don't inadvertantly make hurtful or offensive comments and assumptions. In fact, there was no reason whatsoever for that co-worker of yours to make a presumptive remark about who came to pick you up...all she/he had to do was say, "[kdk], I think your ride is here."

As for your bf being a bit upset about people making assumptions about his age, that is probably true. I'm 36 later this month, and though I look young for my age, I often worry about looking "too old" to be with a woman your age as the years pass, and I do everything I can to hide the few stray gray hairs that are now appearing here and there. What you need to do to alleviate any troublesome feelings on his part is to assure him that you find his appearance very attractive, and he need not be concerned what others think. It may not take all of the hurt feelings away immediately, but it will be very effective if the woman he loves more than anything in this world is holding his hand, or sitting on his lap with her arms around his shoulders as she tells him this. Because he knows how lucky he is to have such a loving and caring YW, your words will mean a lot to him :-)

And as for telling your family...your problems are no different, at the core, than a woman who has to worry about bringing a bf home who is of another race, or of the same gender. Of course, unlike the other two situations, mainstream liberal sensibilities will at least (rightfully) stand behind people in those circumstances. Ageism is still fairly acceptable in our society, even by many liberals, more's the pity. However, again, keep in mind...your family will need to accept your bf and future husband as an important part of your life. As long as he treats you well, and makes you happy, they will come off as increasingly foolish and unfair in their own eyes for disliking him simply because of his age. Nobody needs to be ashamed of their age, or of loving someone of a different age group. Your family has no right to insist that you include social acceptability as part of your marriage contract...the mutual happiness of you and your partner are the most important component of that contract, not how others feel about it.
If you and your bf really love each other, and both of you truly want to get married after a natural amount of deliberation, let nothing hold you back :-)

Originally posted by ItalianKnight

And as for telling your family...your problems are no different, at the core, than a woman who has to worry about bringing a bf home who is of another race, or of the same gender. Of course, unlike the other two situations, mainstream liberal sensibilities will at least (rightfully) stand behind people in those circumstances.

I'm sorry, I just have to jump in here and say that there is first of all a difference between "ageism" and an innocent assumption that the man 20 years her senior is her uncle rather than her boyfriend. Second of all, I personally find it offensive that you are comparing this to the type of social hinderances encountered by same sex or interracial couples.

There are still serious problems that same-sex and interracial couples have to deal with! Same-sex couples still don't have lots and lots of rights that you and I take for granted. Until fairly recently, there were still laws in some states forbiding inter-racial couples to marry as well.

Age disparate relationships, on the other hand, have been around -- indeed encouraged -- for millenia.

Yes, it is frustrating to deal with people whispering and stares and incorrect assumptions, and yes, I know there are lots of parents out there who have a hard time dealing with age disparate relationships. But, legally and societally we don't have to face anything like these other two groups. And I am seriously shocked that you would assert that they have it [i]easier[i] than we do.

That being said, kdk, I would agree with calybo that it seems unfair to your parents if they are paying your rent and don't know about him. If you are really serious about this relationship, it seems like you should trust it enough to tell them. Good luck to you!

hi everyone again :)
thanks calybo, italian knight, and mad bess for your replies... i really appreciate everything you all said!
first of all, i know that it really isn't fair to my parents to not tell them... it really isn't fair to my guy either... he feels like i'm hiding him, which i don't mean to be, but i guess it is how it seems. we met in december, and i really should have told my parents then. i chose not to, and have been too.... chicken i guess is the best word... to tell them since then... i know i will have to eventually, and i am planning on it soon... it's just kind of intimidating...
as for my co-workers... well, i don't really care what they think, but it just made me realize that he really doesn't look as young as i do... but whatever... some people are ignorant and ageist, i suppose...
anyway, things are going well other than that :) i hope i can get to know all of you better...
thank you all again so much!
take care,
peace,
kd

I'm sorry, I just have to jump in here and say that there is first of all a difference between "ageism" and an innocent assumption that the man 20 years her senior is her uncle rather than her boyfriend.

I noted in my post that they likely didn't mean to be insulting by that assumption. I do stand behind my contention, however, that their innocent assumption didn't need to be voiced, and people should be mindful of how such assumptions can inadvertantly be hurtful or offensive.

Second of all, I personally find it offensive that you are comparing this to the type of social hinderances encountered by same sex or interracial couples.

My statement was not intended to be offensive, and I think your above statement is proof positive of my assertion that many people of liberal sensibilities will stand up for those aforementioned minority groups. As bad as they have it in some circles, they also have a large number of defenders. As a long time civil rights activist, I am pleased to see that they have so many defenders, but not pleased that some of liberal sensibilities are so easily offended by statements that were in no way attacking people of such groups. Moreover, I stand by my assertion that many liberals who do not personally have an interest in dating outside of their age gap will be quick to condemn it.

There are still serious problems that same-sex and interracial couples have to deal with! Same-sex couples still don't have lots and lots of rights that you and I take for granted. Until fairly recently, there were still laws in some states forbiding inter-racial couples to marry as well.

I'm well aware of the above. But I stand by my analogy, because I feel that all forms of prejudice are, at the crux, comparable. Hence, I will not refrain from making what I believe to be apt analogies. My point is, you do not have to be a racial or sexual minority in order to be subject to prejudice, and I believe that ageism is a contemporary prejudice that is socially acceptable in many quarters. There are also several ultra-liberals who feel that sexism against women is terrible (and I agree), but comments bashing men are okay because, "men never had to go through what women have, so I'm highly offended by statements saying that women can hold sexist prejudices, also!" Bigotry of any form, against any group of people, is equally bad, and I don't think complaining about any one example of prejudice...and comparing it to other types...is somehow doing an injustice to some of the groups in question. I believe we should unite against all forms of prejudice, not bicker over which ones deserve the concern, and which ones do not.

Age disparate relationships, on the other hand, have been around -- indeed encouraged -- for millenia.

Interracial relationships and homosexual relationships have been around for millennia also, and they weren't issues in many past societies. Age disparate relationships were indeed encouraged in the past, but they have come under serious fire in the 20th century on many levels. Hence, I consider ageism a type of bigotry, and will refer to it as such.


Yes, it is frustrating to deal with people whispering and stares and incorrect assumptions, and yes, I know there are lots of parents out there who have a hard time dealing with age disparate relationships. But, legally and societally we don't have to face anything like these other two groups. And I am seriously shocked that you would assert that they have it easier than we do.

I think the most shocking thing here, Bess, is your oversensitivity on this issue. I clearly stated in my post that it was once highly socially acceptable to treat interracial couples and same gender couples with the same degree of scorn and derision that age disparate relationships are now treated in this society...but currently in this same society, ageism is more or less socially unacceptable, while interracial and same gender couples at least have those of mainstream liberal sensibilities on their side, who have succeeded in making needed changes. Ageism is still bashed on episodes of TV shows, with the plot intended to convey the message that such relationships are either "wrong" or "unworkable despite the good intentions"...you won't see such treatments of bi-racial or same gender relationships on TV with the script written to convey a negative message towards them.
Hence, I stand by what I said, and I would like to ask you to cease being so sensitive on this issue that you take my posts out of context to champion minority groups when it was quite clear that they weren't being attacked.

Italian Knight

Wow. I've got to admit, I don't understand what MadBess finds offensive about comparing one form of discrimination with another; but neither do I understand how ItalianKnight gets the idea that interracial and homosexual relationships have become relatively accepted.

The level and types of acceptance and discrimination portrayed in the media bear little resemblance to what happens out in society. You want an example of a group that is regularly attacked (and almost invariably presented negatively) in the entertainment media? How about evangelical or fundamentalist Christians! In some circles, if you carry that label, you will feel the prejudice. In other circles, you won't. In some circles, homophobia is very much alive, while in others it's not. In some circles racism is a serious problem, while in others it is no issue at all.

The fact is, prejudice is just about everywhere, and how much you see depends on who you are and where you are and where you're coming from.

Another fact is, while prejudice is often founded in ignorance and fear of what is different, it is very often supported by stereotypes which are a caricature of something real.

When it comes to relationships, there are often very sound reasons for friends and family members to be concerned when some aspect of a loved one's relationship diverges from the norm. Initimate relationships are difficult at best, and anything which adds to that difficulty should be considered carefully.

Interracial relationships often carry with them a cultural gap. This is by no means a given, and cultural gaps between two individuals of the same race can be even wider; but legitimate reservations in this area can easily be blown out of proportion and lead to accusations of racism.

Homosexual relationships can....well, let's just not go there, shall we?

Age-gap relationships, depending on the absolute and relative ages of the individuals involved, generally have very serious obstacles to overcome. Frankly, in most cases I think a friend or family member would be remiss if they did not ask questions. If satisfactory answers to those questions can be given, then everybody wins. The issues have been brought into the open and addressed.

Now, kd, I think that in your case the biggest and most immediate issue has nothing to do with the age gap. That issue is of course your living arrangement, as has already been pointed out by others. Unfortunately, you have set yourself up for trouble. If there is any way to get your boyfriend out of your apartment, I would recommend that as a first step. And I do not recommend trying to hide your boyfriend from your parents. I see no point in keeping this kind of thing secret: it is better to see if the relationship survives this kind of exposure early rather than late, and the sooner your parents get to know your boyfriend, the more time they will have to adjust to the idea if the relationship progresses.

As for other people's misunderstandings resulting from the age gap...well, they're going to happen. You don't really have much choice other than to accept it or get out of the relationship.

Originally posted by kdk8503
my parents are actually paying my/our rent, so that helps a lot...

I find this most bothersome, as your folks do not know. I think your folks would also find this bothersome, beyond the age-gap perception they might have. I'm sorry if this may come off as harsh, but at the age of 40, he should be embarrassed.

Other than that, I wish the best for you two:D

Um, yeah. What Saltwater and Calybo said. It's not fair to your parents to keep them in the dark about the fact they're footing the bill for you AND your 40-year old boyfriend. They'd definitely be less than thrilled, probably about the whole relationship, but they're paying his RENT?

Whoa. He should be embarrassed.

Hi and welcome to ageless!!!!

I can't add anything else here... I agree with the above... at 40 years old your parents shouldn't be paying your rent....for both of you.... I know there are circumstances but if your OM is living with you ... he should definatly be able to foot the rent for you...

Your relationship on the other hand is a different story. You sound like your in a very nice relationship and I wish you the best at that!!

Originally posted by SaltwaterBlues
I find this most bothersome, as your folks do not know. I think your folks would also find this bothersome, beyond the age-gap perception they might have. I'm sorry if this may come off as harsh, but at the age of 40, he should be embarrassed.


Sorry to say, but I agree with this. He should be embarrassed. He's *40* years old!

Is it the fact that he's older that you are hiding from your parents, or the fact that he's 40 and still incapable of supporting himself? Sorry if that sounds harsh.

hi everyone,
thanks again for your comments and advice...
i quit the job this morning for several reasons... back to jobhunting...
i know it's not fair to my parents, and i know at 40 he should be able to pay our rent... but with part time work at only $8/hour, he isn't able to... he pays for everything else (bills, groceries, bus passes, etc.), especially now that i am unemployed again.
anyway, thanks again for your advice...
peace,
kd

hi everyone again

Hey there :-)

thanks calybo, italian knight, and mad bess for your replies... i really appreciate everything you all said!

Not a prob, we're all here to help each other out, and happy to do so :-)

first of all, i know that it really isn't fair to my parents to not tell them... it really isn't fair to my guy either... he feels like i'm hiding him, which i don't mean to be, but i guess it is how it seems. we met in december, and i really should have told my parents then. i chose not to, and have been too.... chicken i guess is the best word... to tell them since then... i know i will have to eventually, and i am planning on it soon... it's just kind of intimidating...

Believe me, hon, we all understand how intimidating and overwhelming it can be to tell your parents that you have a relationship partner who may not exactly be to their liking. Family disapproval should never be a reason to avoid a relationship that truly makes us happy and fulfilled on all levels, IMO, but that doesn't mean that family cannot make our lives difficult if we are on the outs with them over so pivitol a matter in our lives. Discuss talking to your parents with your bf, get his input, and together, make plans to officially drop the news on them. And keep in mind that everyone on the forum will be here for you. Also, everything will work out in the end if the two of you truly love each other...your family will see that, and come to accept him in time if this is the case...and it certainly seems to be :-)

as for my co-workers... well, i don't really care what they think, but it just made me realize that he really doesn't look as young as i do... but whatever... some people are ignorant and ageist, i suppose...

As I noted before, I stand behind my assessment that people should be wary of making such assumptions, and then verbally stating them. Again, I'm not saying that your co-workers meant any harm, but it's quite clear that such assumptive comments, innocently made or otherwise, can nevertheless be hurtful to the party involved. People can be as hurtful inadvertantly as they can deliberately, and I simply said that we do need to be mindful of always verbally articulating what we may be thinking or assuming. Your co-worker(s) didn't have to mention the "dad or uncle" thing...they simply could have said, "Your ride's here." I think this goes to show that ageism is alive and well, and a surprisingly acceptable form of bigotry at present, more's the pity.

anyway, things are going well other than that i hope i can get to know all of you better...

Ditto, and I'm glad to hear that everything else is going well :-)

thank you all again so much!

Not a prob, I'm glad that we could be here for you :-)

Italian Knight

hello all again,
sorry it has been so long since i've been here... i was a little frustrated at myself and my situation, so i just stayed away... but i have had a lot of progress...
i haven't been sleeping well, and i realized that it is because i am so tired of just living like this, lying to my parents, and not respecting my boyfriend by telling them about him. so, i woke up yesterday morning and wrote this long letter to my parents.
i went to work yesterday, and (to make a long story short) i ended up in the emergency room all afternoon because my knee gave out on me. my manager at work drove me there and my boyfriend met me there... i was so thankful to not be alone.
anyway, after that whole experience, i called home to tell my parents i was alive, and ended up reading my mom the whole letter, at a bus stop, bawling...
she talked to my dad, and then called me later... they were upset that i lied, of course, and my mom was sad that we are living together and not married... they handled it better than i thought, and while things are a little ackward between us all right now, i am so glad to have told them. it was hard, and it probably won't make everything better right away... but the hardest part is done...
annoying thing- i'm under my parents' insurance, so i'm probably going to have to go back to colorado to have surgery because it won't be convered here out of state... so i spent the day on the phone trying to figure out if i qualify for anything here to help pay for it here...
anyway, thanks all for your kind responses...i hope all is going well for everyone here...
peace,
kd :)