Need advise with her Daughters behavior

Just to introduce my situation:
I am borrowing my friends screen name for this post cause I just wanted to drop a quick line. Both myself and my buddy have Ow/ym relationships.

Anyways. My Ow and myself are married. Have been for 4 years now. We live together and her kids are out of the house.

They youngest one who i will call "kelly" is 18 years of age and has started rather odd behavior. We don't have a "close" relationship at all. She has been living with her father for the last 10 years.

I want to know if she is trying to flurt with me or not cause I need to put a stop to this if she is... I don't want to come out and just say something and sound "egotiscial" or assume anything.

Her behavior includes:

Coming over wereing the tightest clothes imaginable, short skirt, tube tops, etc. (she never did this before)

Constantly prancing back and forth in front of me while I am sitting reading the paper...or watching t.v

Bending over infront of me to "pickthings up" while my ow isn't in the room

Leaning forward across counters and tables and letting her chest hang out.

All of a sudden she is strikes up conversation w/ me on the slightest of issues.

Coming over when she knows my Ow is at work..she works untill 9.
And basically follows me around the house saying "what are u doing", can I help?, what are u reading?

she never acted or dress liking this in the past.

Whatz the deal..is she just entering a "lookat me" phase???

Is she just being a "bad girl" and thinks that taboo is fun?? and things will pass.

Do girls just like seeing if they can seduce a guy for the fuN of it???

What are some clear signs of Flurting..that I can bring up to my OW or her daughter without sounding like some egotist.

I am afraid she will just deny everything and I will look like a total Asss

I don't want to rock the boat here to much cause I am just not sure what to think.

Well, I would broach the subject with your OW. Not so much in an accusatory way, but in a "look, I feel uncomfortable about this... BUT" kind of way.

The daughter IS making you feel uncomfortable and needs to knock it off, whatever her reasoning may be.

Could she be flirting with you? Sure. Could it be because you're off limits and/or taboo? Absolutely. Could it just be a phase? Again, sure!

BUT, that's not the point. You don't like her coming over when her mother isn't there, dressed provacatively, flaunting her feminity in your face. It makes you uncomfortable!! ENUF SAID.

Tell your OW she needs to talk to her daughter. Tell her WHY she needs to talk to her daughter. YOU will not look like an *** unless you say it like, "Hey, your daughter wants to get in my pants" or something stupid like that.

Just be honest. You're not comfortable with the way she's dressing, you're worried about HER and how she's coming off to others (not just you) and you think her mother should intervene and figure out what's going on. While she's at it, setting some ground rules would be GOOD. Such as, "don't come over when I'm not here. YM needs his space and privacy." and the like.

Good luck!
~phosphorescent

serene96, you are good guy, sometimes i think us wemon-folk have lofty ideas regarding men and we think that once a guy has standards he is untoppable. well, i dont believe that is true, i believe God made you guys to have a different sexual make up. with that being said, if i knew you, i would hug you for speaking up, i believe that incidents like the one you are describing can be nipped in the bud if the man honestly puts his feelings out there and looks for help. congrats.

now the problem of how to approach the mom..... your wife. honesty is KEY, however how to package this information is also a biggy. since i dont know your wife i dont know how she will react. i do know (as a woman) this little girl knows EXACTLY what she is doing and because she is just a little girl she does not even come close to understanding the severity of her actions. one of the biggest gifts you can give her is to be the type of man that lets her know in very clear language that she is behaving innappropriate for a step daughter. also, you may want to explain that her manner of dress will give the wrong guys the wrong impression.

you say that she has not lived with her mom for a long time, thats tricky... the last thing that you want to do is to have the mother alienate the daughter. possibly you can ask your wife if she is noticing her daughters attire and also let her know that she is practicing her look and asking you for an opinion and you are just not comfortable in that role, it really SHOULD be her mother who has a talk with her regarding her dress.... no mom want her little girl to be a hootchy-mama.

anyway, thread lightly but swiftly. please let us know how it all works out.

I agree, your stepdaughter needs some guidelines and rules as to how to appropriately behave around her stepfather.

If I had a daughter (I have three young sons) and she was 18 and flirting with my boyfriend/husband I would not be angry with my partner and I would be understanding towards my daughter for her age-appropriate, yet morally inappropriate behavior and set some limitations for her to allow my partner to feel more comfortable.

I agree that you should discuss this with your partner and NOT with her daughter. This is a parenting issue that your partner needs to take the lead in acting upon. Your role in parenting her over this is going to be determined by your partner on this one.

Welcome to Ageless, perhaps you'll start your own account :)

one of the biggest gifts you can give her is to be the type of man that lets her know in very clear language that she is behaving innappropriate for a step daughter. also, you may want to explain that her manner of dress will give the wrong guys the wrong impression.

That sounds like a good idea but I'm afraid that it might cause some negative feelings beteen himself and his partner if he takes the lead in parenting on this issue due to the fact that the girl hasn't been around much in the past and he hasn't been actively involved in parenting her thus far. I'm assuming this from his initial post of course, I'm not sure what the situation is there.

I honestly think it would be better to discuss this with his partner and allow her to take the parenting lead and guide "Serene96" through this.

She may even just fluff it off and say to ignore it, not realizing how much of a problem this is for him. In that case I, as Serene96 would say something directly to the daughter myself.

it really SHOULD be her mother who has a talk with her regarding her dress.... no mom want her little girl to be a hootchy-mama.

anyway, thread lightly but swiftly.

Great point, kittylane! I was just telling Litical the other day, as we watched some 12 year old girl cross the street dressed like a HOOKER that; I SWEAR I will NEVER let my daughter out of the house looking like that. I will inspect her backpacks, I will ensure she never owns anything so classless and disgusting and I will ground her butt for the duration of her teen years if I ever catch her walking around dressed like a common street *****. The really sad thing is this girl we saw was no older than 12!!!

Yes, I said all those words to my YM. He agreed wholeheartedly! The WAY girls are dressing these days... *shudder* I actually laughed at my 11 year old cousin the other day for what she was wearing and said, "What the HELL do you have on?" I told her it looked trashy and ridiculous and that she shouldn't "follow" styles but MAKE them. She agreed, oddly.

But, YOU should not talk to the daughter. Your wife needs to do the talking and to ask her questions, instead of insisting she looks like trash. As in "what do you think you're accomplishing by dressing so provacatively? What kind of guys do you think you'll attract like that?" The Mom should LEAD her to her OWN answers!!! Leading questions. LOVE 'EM.

Anyway, talk to your OW soon. Definitely let us know how it goes!!
~phos

I may be totally off mark here and this isn't really advice, but has anyone considered that the daughter disapproves of the relationship and she's set out to show what a 'bad' boy her mother has gotten involved with? That he's young and he'll eventually leave her for a younger woman so why not prove it now before her mother gets hurt? It almost sounds like a set up; a trap if you will.

Like I said, I could be totally nutso, but that was the first image that came to mind. If she were dressing this way in general and not making the obvious flirtatious overtures then yes, I'd say it's a phase and her choice of attire needs to be discussed. (Her mother only) BUT, she's coming over when her mother isn't home and never used to do that before, plus she truly is doing purposely provacative things like she is determinedly trying to get the YM's attention. *shrugs* Maybe I'm paranoid. :confused:

She probably has a crush on you. How you treat her could affect her self esteem. This very thing happened with my YM and I when we were married. My daughter was 16 and came out into the living room with some scanty baby doll PJ's. He came to me (in bed with our newborn :) )and said, "would you do something about your daughter? I mean I have no designs on her but her coming in half naked.... a guy can only take so much. And he was RIGHT. Just cause it is wrong... there is no reason to tempt an innocent person.

The mom needs to talk to her and find out what the daughters feelings are. She may deny the crush, but she should be instructed to not come over unless Mom is also home and to wear clothes that she would wear to a 'chuch retreat". :D

At any rate.. treat it lightly and don't be down on the girl. Just consider it a minor annoyance that Mom can take care of. Good luck!

All good advice and I agree that you're right to take it seriously. Since this happens when your wife isn't around, kelly's going to know you said something so I'm wondering if, to avoid bad feelings, you could talk about this with your wife first, then sit down with kelly and your wife, and say, "Kelly, I asked your Mom to talk to you about something that's bothering me." Then let your wife take over.

I disagree with those that say that she should be told that what she's wearing will "give guys the wrong impression". She's 18 years old... she knows exactly what impression she's giving and it's all intentional.

Now the question is why... she's obviously trying to get a reaction from you, OP, but probably not trying to get something actually started, you know? She probably just wants attention.

I had the same first impression as Sdoah1972, thinking that maybe she was trying to prove to the mom what a bad guy you are. *Shrug* I dunno, it's possible.

I definitely agree that you should talk to your wife, and not the girl. If nothing else, this shouldn't be something that is kept from your wife.

I may be totally off mark here and this isn't really advice, but has anyone considered that the daughter disapproves of the relationship and she's set out to show what a 'bad' boy her mother has gotten involved with? That he's young and he'll eventually leave her for a younger woman so why not prove it now before her mother gets hurt? It almost sounds like a set up; a trap if you will.

Like I said, I could be totally nutso, but that was the first image that came to mind. If she were dressing this way in general and not making the obvious flirtatious overtures then yes, I'd say it's a phase and her choice of attire needs to be discussed. (Her mother only) BUT, she's coming over when her mother isn't home and never used to do that before, plus she truly is doing purposely provacative things like she is determinedly trying to get the YM's attention. *shrugs* Maybe I'm paranoid. :confused:

I rode the school bus with a 15 year old girl who was sleeping with her mom's bf and she and her mom's bf were planning to get married, after she turned 18. Happy family.
Ali

no legally blond.... not right on, this guy is a man who is saying that this little hootchy is getting to him. this is not a guy who is sampling the merchandise.

a man should not be tempted in his own home and then on top of it have to package the information not to upset his wife because it is her own daughter who is guilty of doing it. this is a GOOD man, i just hope he finds a way to put a stop to this crap.

Well I had a tlk with my ow last night..

I asked her if she had noticed a change in her daughters behavior.

She said "yes" she noticed that her daughter was coming on to me.

I told her that I wasn't comfortable with the situation and that her daughter shouldn't be allowed over w/o somebody at the house w/ me.

She agreed but was a little hesitant cause she didn't want to make her daughter feel like she was being pushed away.

So she is going to call her daughter and just tell her that she isn't allowed over unless her mother is there. The reason will be: we don't think its "appropriate" for her to be over and alone in the house with a married man.

Were not going to say anything about her flurting or her dress for now. My ow will be careful to be by my side and vice versa when her daughter is over. We hope she will eventually just get "bored" of trying or frustrated with her inability to "single" me out and start her antics up again. I'll make it a point to be congenial but business like for awhile or go in the computer room/den and lock the door.

We don't want to offend her...she is 18 and doesn't live under her mother's roof so telling her "how" to dress is a litte out of place In our opinion. My Ow still wants a good relationship with her minus this new behavior. We are just going to take away "opportunity".

Thx for the advice gang we will keep you posted

no legally blond.... not right on, this guy is a man who is saying that this little hootchy is getting to him. this is not a guy who is sampling the merchandise.

a man should not be tempted in his own home and then on top of it have to package the information not to upset his wife because it is her own daughter who is guilty of doing it. this is a GOOD man, i just hope he finds a way to put a stop to this crap.

I don't believe LB was questioning the motives of the OP, but the motives of the daughter, which is what I was questioning as well. She was just giving a personal example of such things. I too believe the OP is genuine and doesn't have ulterior designs upon the daughter, but I believe the daughter has some kind of ulterior motive for her behavior save just 'attention'. But that's my opinion.

OP, how is your wife's relationship with her daughter? Is there any bitterness between the two or discord?

I don't believe LB was questioning the motives of the OP, but the motives of the daughter, which is what I was questioning as well. She was just giving a personal example of such things. I too believe the OP is genuine and doesn't have ulterior designs upon the daughter, but I believe the daughter has some kind of ulterior motive for her behavior save just 'attention'. But that's my opinion.

OP, how is your wife's relationship with her daughter? Is there any bitterness between the two or discord?

I think this is a very significant point. I do not believe that this kind of a situation occurs naturally in a family where the relationship dynamics are healthy and intact. If this is occuring, then there I would think that there MUST be an issue between mom and daughter.

Marcy... I somewhat disagree...
Without the bio-dad taboo, having a crush on a step-father, esp. when he is young, is not at all uncommon. We took my oldest daughter the therapy and that was what we were told. The teen needs Dad's attention and without the natural boundaries, it becomes more sexual, whereas with a Dad it is "AHHH never!"
"

Oh I agree YR... but you must admit... it is one thing to develop a crush... anyone can do that... it is entirely another to act on it.

That is true... but without those natural boundaries... and how some 18 year olds are... plus you add a young man who is at the peak of his sexuality... it happens more than it should. And when it does ... THEN you do have a dysfunctional family. Unfortunately... 'cause it is the OW who pays more than anyone with her trust totally shattered by family and "men". :(

Go for it. Then write a story about it since there seems to be so many other stories around the net like it.

I am not "going" for anything. I was hoping to get some intelligent advice off this. I am an ex football player that has no idea what a 17 year girl is thinking. I dont know whether to threaten to tell her mom unless this stops or tell her anyways. Waking up to her "snuggling" is something that I think that is inappropriate touching at that age. As i have said, I love my wife very much, and never in a million years thought that this would be a situation I would have to deal with and overcome. Her father is not in the picture so I have thought that maybe this behavior is more indictive of someone seeking a father figure. I am not at all attracted to my stepdaughter but sort of yelling at her and perhaps ruining our relationship does anyone have any worthy advice? Is this just a temporary stage?

I am not "going" for anything. I was hoping to get some intelligent advice off this. I am an ex football player that has no idea what a 17 year girl is thinking. I dont know whether to threaten to tell her mom unless this stops or tell her anyways. Waking up to her "snuggling" is something that I think that is inappropriate touching at that age. As i have said, I love my wife very much, and never in a million years thought that this would be a situation I would have to deal with and overcome. Her father is not in the picture so I have thought that maybe this behavior is more indictive of someone seeking a father figure. I am not at all attracted to my stepdaughter but sort of yelling at her and perhaps ruining our relationship does anyone have any worthy advice? Is this just a temporary stage?


How long has this been going on? And you haven't told your wife yet???? If I were the wife, I would think there was something being reciprocated if I found out about this after such a long time.... why the hell aren't you being honest with your wife about this?

Needhelp who cares if she has a crash on you or not, that should be the least of your concerns. You should be concerned about respect and the impropriety of the situation. Also, in one of your post you said something about being half asleep late at night, so I wonder how you reacted, are you guilty of doing some thing inappropriate?

Regardless, you MUST to talk with your wife right away, even if there is a risk of mom saying she has to move out. It is a very sensible situation, otherwise it may mean your marriage is out the window if your wife finds out without you telling her. So think hard and tell your wife. Do not even go to your step kid first, that would be a big mistake. And by the way, don't be surprised if your step daughter turns things around and tells her mother you initiated it!, so you better have a solid relationship with your wife and honestly I have my doubts.

You are up against some big storm ahead of you, so grab the bull by the horns and come out with the truth to your wife right away.

Good luck to you! :)

Why haven't you talked to your wife about this?

Have you behaved in a way unappropriate of a "step father"?

ALTARUBIAGUAPA

Thanks I appreciate your response. I did modify my original posting to try and better illustrate my specific issue or concern. To clarify, I do feel guilty a couple times when Ive been half asleep and noticed she was in the room and I guess condoned the behavior to some extent by not dismissing her, but getting up and going into another room. As far as the relationship with my wife is concerned, I cant imagine my life with out her, and I fear talking to her about this because of the strong possibility that it could be turned around especially as a defensive reaction by my stepdaughter. In that situation, regardless of who she believes, I would think all relationships would be severed. I have done nothing inappropriate to perceive this as "hiding" anything from my wife, I'm just concerned about the outcome and resolution of all this once I tell her. As I mentioned earlier I am an ex football player, current coach and not the best at communication.

Troubled

Needhelp, don't think about it any longer. Write your thoughts down if you feel you can express yourself better but tell your wife face to face. Be very focus, and then cool, calmed ,and collected and tell her NOW. The longer you wait the more "wrong" it may seem.

And as you would tell your team GO FOR IT!

Good luck, again!

Heh. Well, I'm not sure why the locked door didn't work... I think that's a fabulous idea. If she just breaks the lock, then I'd recommend getting a sliding bolt lock -- that's what my husband and I put on our door and it works like a dream! I agree with everyone else, too; talk to your OW about it... she needs to be in the know.

This is what I would do. I would call your wife and step daughter together and talk to them BOTH at the same time. Then you avoid the "he said, she said" situation.

Staying calm and in control is the key to a successful discussion. I'd start off by saying that you are uncormfortable with the situation, that you haven't been able to get your step daughter to understand how you feel about her being overly affectionate, and you'd like all of you set boundaries as a family as to what is appropriate and what is not. If this discussion is not successful and you are not able to feel comfortable, then you all should go to family counseling and get professional assistance to set these boundaries.

The best way to approach this is not that someone wins and someone loses. It's not the case at all. It's a case where your step daughter needs firm boundaries set and you and your wife need to enforce them with her. With a little luck, and persistence, you should get through this just fine.

Keep the door locked. Period. Wouldn't that solve everything? :confused:

For most of the time these occurances are pretty innocent if handled correctly. Children are still exploring boundries and in a raging hormone period of their life. It's pretty common for these things to happen even with bio-dads. I know both of my own daughters have pranced around in their "under thingys" until I had the talk with them that it embarasses their father. It's the same principle as kids getting crushes on teachers. I taught 9th grade when I was 28 yrs. old. One kid got the worst crush on me. He was very flirty. And actually he was a little doll. It got so bad I had to tell him if he would back off now when he turned 18 he could look me up and we'd see. That satisfied him and it stopped. <giggles> Of course he never did. Now he'd just be my YM man right? ;) I do realize at 17, she is nearly grown and probably knows exactly what she is doing. But...still she is a child. She is craving male attention and doesn't exactly know how to channel it. She has to be guided. I would talk with both of them at the same time to avoid any confusion. Since you are a Coach and conversation is hard for you here is an example:
On Thursday at 6:00pm we are having a family meeting.
<Meeting>

I called you both together for a family meeting so we could learn to communicate better with one another. As you both know conversation doesn't come easy to me so I thought with all of us together as a family unit if would help me. First off I would like to talk about respecting boundries. Such as when doors are locked, it means the person behind that door wishes privacy. <turn to step daughter>Now, I respect your privacy and I request that you respect mine. When my door is locked please don't pick it and enter. I could be undressing and it would embarass me. <at this point it's going to be a shock to the Mom> but the Mom is probably not going to assume anything other than a lack of respect for entering a locked door. I'd skip the part about her trying to snuggle, unless of course the conversation leads to it. I think the daughter at this point should get the hint.

Then I'd lead the discussion to.. if anything was bothering anyone else as far as family issues that they would like to discuss.

After discussing maybe other lighter topics I'd suggest a family night once a week to communicate with each other. Put it off on yourseelf saying it is easier for you to do it this way. Suggest maybe a dinner out together. Then make a point of asking the step daughter how school is going, what's going on with friends, etc. Is there anything that her Mother and I need to help you with?

In other words make her feel the daughter role and you the father role. I think things will stop.

I hope this helps.

Thanks, for your response. I had the "talk" last night and everything wasnt nearly as bad as I had built up in my head, almost like it was not unforseeable (I guess there are signs that a mother notices). So in any event, a good stern talk really helped, I just hope it has worked. We are trying to move on from here with a positive note, suggested dinner as a "family" this week, in part in celebration of her 18th birthday and to hopefully bring us all a little closer again and begin the next chapter I suppose. Thanks for your assistance, I actually cut and spoke verbatim from what you had posted, hope you dont mind :) and it went alot smoother than if i didnt have it as a resource. They really should invent a manual for young stepfathers that have spouses with adolescent teenagers...lol

Just curious...how old are you? The daughter is 17 right?

Thanks, for your response. I had the "talk" last night and everything wasnt nearly as bad as I had built up in my head, almost like it was not unforseeable (I guess there are signs that a mother notices). So in any event, a good stern talk really helped, I just hope it has worked. We are trying to move on from here with a positive note, suggested dinner as a "family" this week, in part in celebration of her 18th birthday and to hopefully bring us all a little closer again and begin the next chapter I suppose. Thanks for your assistance, I actually cut and spoke verbatim from what you had posted, hope you dont mind :) and it went alot smoother than if i didnt have it as a resource. They really should invent a manual for young stepfathers that have spouses with adolescent teenagers...lol

There you go!!! YOU write a book about it, you are an educator and in the best position. Since you don't communicate well it would be the perfect way for you to get your word out. I think it's a wonderful idea. Tell your wife to help you since it's not easy for you to do this sort of thing. You could relay your thoughts and she could put the book together. Can you imagine how many men would relate since you are a Coach. They might actually pay attention.

I'll bet your wife was actually having trouble bringing the subject up to you knowing how you are. She was probably in as much turmoil. I'll bet she is so indebted to you knowing you took the HUSBAND and FATHER role so seriously. I'm so glad you used my words....it makes me feel so good.

And to ageless....the man asked for what to say and do and some of you guys pointed the finger. Get off your high horse and quit persecuting every man for baggage you've been exposed to in your life or what you've heard from some other bitter person. Older women can be very open minded for the most part but sometimes having so much history can blind some to the fact that there are good men out there that just don't have the experience to deal with everything that is being thrown at them in these relationships.

Kudos to you Coach... that is wonderful. I am glad that you took action. Not to be a downer but SOMETIMES the behavior escalates before it is extingished. If that happens, just have your meeting again and be a little more insistent. You will get there!

And Sara... very well said!

Kudos to you Coach... that is wonderful. I am glad that you took action. Not to be a downer but SOMETIMES the behavior escalates before it is extingished. If that happens, just have your meeting again and be a little more insistent. You will get there!

And Sara... very well said!

Thanks YR coming from you I consider that a compliment. I think you are a very open minded and forgiving person and one who doesn't seem to jump to conclusions. :)

I'm a little confused about who the OP is and whether or not he has spoken to his wife and worked out some boundaries for everyone in the household to follow. I hope so, as he sounds like a genuine good guy.

But, just a little off-topic ... after reading through the posts I found a trend quite interesting really...this step daughter is 18 (the age of many vym boyfriends of women here on the boards...and the age of my exym when we first fell in love); yet except for one or two posts calling her a full-fledged adult who knows the consequences of her actions and can make totally responsible decisions about her choices and actions in her life, these statements (and others) were made by other thread contributors:

Children are still exploring boundaries and in a raging hormone period of their life.

If I had a daughter (I have three young sons) and she was 18..... I would be understanding towards my daughter for her age-appropriate, yet morally inappropriate behavior

…this little girl knows EXACTLY what she is doing and because she is just a little girl she does not even come close to understanding the severity of her actions.

I want to interject that I TOTALLY agree with the above quotes (please don't think I'm bashing any of the posts at all, I think they support what I believe to be SO true)....I completely think that vyp are in a different category than adults 25 and up in their judgement capabilities due to so many factors (maturity, life experience difs, hormones, brain-growth not complete yet, etc.)...and that because of that fact, we as OW need to tread lightly and make responsible decisions based in good judgment concerning relationships with vym 18-21. I'm not discounting the viability of SOME relationships with vym, but MOST don't work for the long haul because they are just too young to be asked to make lifetime comittment decisions.

Some of us OW have purported these sentiments regarding vym (many from wisdom gained through personal experience in past AGR's with vym), but are shot down and often told that a vym's behavior is not age-related...or that they are capable of making solid life decisions about relationships with us because they are legal adults, etc.. Some may be, the majority are not.

I sensed some discrepancy and just thought I'd mention it as something to ponder... :D

I'm a little confused about who the OP is and whether or not he has spoken to his wife and worked out some boundaries for everyone in the household to follow. I hope so, as he sounds like a genuine good guy.

But, just a little off-topic ... after reading through the posts I found a trend quite interesting really...this step daughter is 18 (the age of many vym boyfriends of women here on the boards...and the age of my exym when we first fell in love); yet except for one or two posts calling her a full-fledged adult who knows the consequences of her actions and can make totally responsible decisions about her choices and actions in her life, these statements (and others) were made by other thread contributors:

Children are still exploring boundaries and in a raging hormone period of their life.

If I had a daughter (I have three young sons) and she was 18..... I would be understanding towards my daughter for her age-appropriate, yet morally inappropriate behavior

…this little girl knows EXACTLY what she is doing and because she is just a little girl she does not even come close to understanding the severity of her actions.

I want to interject that I TOTALLY agree with the above quotes (please don't think I'm bashing any of the posts at all, I think they support what I believe to be SO true)....I completely think that vyp are in a different category than adults 25 and up in their judgement capabilities due to so many factors (maturity, life experience difs, hormones, brain-growth not complete yet, etc.)...and that because of that fact, we as OW need to tread lightly and make responsible decisions based in good judgment concerning relationships with vym 18-21. I'm not discounting the viability of SOME relationships with vym, but MOST don't work for the long haul because they are just too young to be asked to make lifetime comittment decisions.

Some of us OW have purported these sentiments regarding vym (many from wisdom gained through personal experience in past AGR's with vym), but are shot down and often told that a vym's behavior is not age-related...or that they are capable of making solid life decisions about relationships with us because they are legal adults, etc.. Some may be, the majority are not.

I sensed some discrepancy and just thought I'd mention it as something to ponder... :D


Special K.....I have to agree with you. Whereas young people are considered adult at 18, they are not. I too have read the posts defending the ages 18-21 in regards to making their own decisions. I just don't agree. Maybe because I have a 23 yr. old daughter that makes most of her own decisions but still comes to me asking advice and I see the immature mindset. I know there can be exceptions...but for the most part just simply lack the history.

If the daughter's is trying to attract the mom's bf, it's not just a boundary issue, it's a moral one. People develop morals and understand right and wrong long before 18.

If I were the mom, I would find someway to get to the bottom of this because if she flirting with mom's bf, what's she doing with her girlfriends' bf's or some other attached guy. If she wants one of them, she goes after him behind their backs? I'd be wondering what kind of person she was and addressing it. Going after someone who is in a relationship with someone else, especially someone in a relationship with their own mother is not typical 18 year old behavior.

Hey thats a good point Ramblin; behaviour like that can lose quality friendships, attract the wrong kind of bosses and attention in the workforce, which she will join soon ( if not already), and possibly attract the wrong guys too. It affects all aspects of a young woman's life, and the impression she makes on other people.

I agree w/SpecialK, I saw the same trend as well. Its as if we dismiss our daughters feelings into what is essentially to have a relationship with one of her peers. The ym isn't our peer its hers, so why would there be a boundary...because he's boinking the ow, which is what she's thinking is all there is. Even at 17/18 she can't imagine a ym wanting to be with her mother and not her. Commitment is only as good as the two people choose to practice and for the most part young people change their minds from one sec to the next. There are very few who have such old souls that just being married is

Good grief even Demi Moore's daughter had a crush on what's-his-face. Although he's like 11 years older than her, considering that yw have always dated om, it was understandable for her. Ashton, that's it, is NOT her father, doesn't even look like one, in her mind I'm sure it took a long time to make the transition from someone she could be interested in to someone her mother was living with and boinking.

One has to trend lightly with our children, one doesn't want that child to feel that they are being phased out because some parent feels their obligation to parent is over at 18 and it is not. Legally she may be an adult in society's eyes but mentally the real person starts to emotionally come forth after. Its quite a transformation, no different then ym except its alot faster. And then you're 25 and the basic personality that emerges is who you are throughout your lifetime. Its fantastic.

Paris

I'd be wondering what kind of person she was and addressing it. Going after someone who is in a relationship with someone else, especially someone in a relationship with their own mother is not typical 18 year old behavior. Actually it is more typical than you would think.

Having been there and also in women's therapy groups, the step-parent family is loaded with minefields. This seems to be especially true if the daughter needs a male's attention due to a lack of 'Fathering'. These gals act on impulses, not wisdom or morales. But you are right... it has to be dealt with and stopped before more happens.

What is sad, is the number of step-dads that do not set a boundary, and allow it to escalate or even encourage it. If you have a YM that lacks self esteem or is a closet sex addict then the OW may be hurt to the core of her soul. :(

If I'm not mistaken, NeedHelp33 is married to this girl's mother and he is not her peer. He is 32.

Shan

I agree w/SpecialK, I saw the same trend as well. Its as if we dismiss our daughters feelings into what is essentially to have a relationship with one of her peers. The ym isn't our peer its hers, so why would there be a boundary...because he's boinking the ow, which is what she's thinking is all there is. Even at 17/18 she can't imagine a ym wanting to be with her mother and not her. Commitment is only as good as the two people choose to practice and for the most part young people change their minds from one sec to the next. There are very few who have such old souls that just being married is

They're not peers. If the 18 year old was actually in a relationship with the 32 year old "YM", they'd be on the YW/OM forum and he'd be an OM. As it stands, he's only young in relation to the mother. Even if Needhelp33 were in her age group --so what. That doesn't mean she should go after him if he belongs to someone else.

Nevertheless, I don't mean to sound heartless but there's an issue of loyalty and respect that's missing here for a daughter to go after her mother's bf. And even if it’s common, it's still a breakdown in the family and it it should be dealt with because that's a serious and sad problem.

We dismiss too many destructive behaviors of our kids and strike it off as youthful behavior. Being young is not synonymous with retardation or not knowing the difference between right and wrong. Inexperience yes-- not knowing the difference between right and wrong, NO. Not many people can admit to themselves that their children have character flaws, but many children do, just as we do. I would address it, whether it was a charater flaw, misguided youth or anything else because if i had a daughter that did that, I would bring it out in the open with her because I wouldn't want her to continue that kind of destructive behavior with others and I want to avert her from damaging my relationship with her even though it wouldn't stop me from loving her.

As children grow up, we try to give them the tools they need to make decisions and choices, then cross our finger, legs and toes to make sure that they do. But at a certain point, the choice is theirs. We can only offer guidance but they have to be willing to accept and recognize it, work with what info they learned thus far, and use the common sense they should of devleoped by now that will help them survive their own future.

The ym isn't our peer its hers, so why would there be a boundary...because he's boinking the ow, which is what she's thinking is all there is.

Yes, I think thats a good enough reason to set a boundary; I'm actually surprised that you don't agree? He someone else's bf for a start.....even more improtantly, its her own mother's bf, someone who has spent the last 18 years devoted to her upbringing. Sheesh, if doesn't deserve some loyalty, what does?

I dont quite get the `peer' thing either. Apart from the fact that they are NOT peers, should she be encoruaged to go after any `taken' guy her age, no matter who it hurts or offends?

I have to agree once again with Ramblin; parents owe it to their children to teach them right from wrong and to set appropriate boundaries when necessary.