Difficult Situation

I have been grappling with an odd situation for several months now and self analysis and therapy and talking - probably incessantly with the people involved - hasn't given me the peace of mind I have been searching for...

so, I was hoping maybe a few other opinions might help me out. This is a long story, but I will try to make it concise.

Basically, my husband and I had a pretty unfulfilling personal relationship but a good working relationship (he helps me with my veterinary practice). My husband says he can remember the last time we acted in love....when I got back from a business trip/vacation in May 2001....so anyway, we split up about 6 months ago. The break up was probably inevitable, but me meeting a really great YM certainly was a catalyst.

I have always been a very open and honest person - I did not cheat on my husband, in fact I went to counseling and tried to get my husband to go to counseling for months. I knew I was getting emotional stimulation from this other person that I wanted to have with my husband.

Anyway, he never wanted to work on things, he acted totally fine with us splitting up - he knew I felt this other person was a soulmate and that I needed that kind of relationship and emotional stimulation in my life. However, when I actually went to go visit this other person and it was the most amazing experience ever...then all of a sudden, my husband wants to work things out. And he is making changes and we are talking like we haven't done in years.

I understand that some people don't realize what they have until it's gone, that me actually going to be with another person was a serious slap in the face. But what I am struggling with is the desire to be a good partner, someone who doesn't give up on a person they have been with for a long time (9 years) for a "fling".

But the thing is, I feel so much like this other person truly IS a soulmate. We connect in every way and he expresses his feelings, wants to be with me forever and in general gives me the emotional support that was so lacking in my marriage.

I am supposed to go and see him again in 4 weeks and I am totally excited about the trip. My husband wants me to stay and try and make things work with us - and my heart just isn't in it.

I feel selfish and also a little foolish...when I am talking to this other person, the years don't seem to exist - we love each other so deeply and completely, but at the same time, no matter how mature he seems and how sure he seems, he is very young - yes he is legal, but not by much... :o

My heart is torn. My husband and I are still friends, we are still working together part time for now while he goes back to school. My YM is understanding of everything...I am the one who is having the difficulty here. I hate hurting anyone I care about - and I do care about my husband, I am just not IN love with him. But could it be rekindled?

When I am honest with myself, I do not think I could give 100% to trying to make things different with my husband b/c I would be regretting not having that chance with this other person.

Wow, not very concise here - a lot of rambling. Anyway, I think I'll leave it at that for now...thanks. :)

been there... tried to make it work, but like you, i was past the point where it could work. i made my break, followed up and met my YM who was LD, and never looked back. and no regrets...

all the best to you in this hard time. but follow your heart...

All I can say is follow your heart..Looks like you tried and made a decision on what you want to truly do. I just can't see me living with someone who wasn't in love with me ..I know you don't want to hurt anyone but I think staying with your husband and not being in love with him any longer.... would only hurt him in the long run. Listen to your heart

Eponavet,

You asked if love could be rekindled......I'd say `yes', but not while you are seeing another man with whom you are in lust/love. These new feelings of lustful excitement and connection are so strong, it would be virtually impossible for `an old shoe' to compete with all of that.

I think if you wanted to seriously give your marriage a chance, you'd have to stop seeing the YM. Not saying you should or shouldn't do that, but I believe it would be necessary if you want to get back in touch with your true feelings for your husband. You never know, there might still be a great deal of love there..maybe even greater passion than you are able to access right now..... only its supressed and swept aside because you're in the lustful honeymoon stages of a relationship with another man.

I couldn't possbly guess the best decision for you, but whatever decision you make, try to make it based on rational thought, not lust. The lust you feel for the new guy will subside too, and you'll be left with, well, basically a boy who is just starting out in life, with many immature traits that will drive you nuts sometimes.

From what has been reported on this forum, relationships with 18-20 yo YM can sometimes work our beautifully, but usually they don't. They can have the best of intentions, but just not enough experience to see through their committments; to even understand what they truly want. Not wanting to be a big downer, but i feel these are the kinds of things you should be weighing up before tossing in a marriage that is working well right now.

Either way. i wish you the best happiness, and whatever decision you make, you can be sure you'll have plenty of support here!

I think we know in our hearts when it's over. And some of us stay because we have stayed for so long we figure what's a little more time? "I OWE him this one last chance, He needs me, he just didn't know it until now."

But really is it fair to go back in order to ease your conscience? To give him a false hope and false sense of security when you know it's over? Is if fair to give him another 6 months of only half of you then leaving again and him having to start healing then?

If your not going back don't let it be because of the other man, let it be because you are doing what is right for you. If you do go back same thing.. don't go back because of your husband, but because you are doing what is right for you.

I spent 10 years hoping my relationship would get better, it never did. Once I left he begged for another chance, I just couldn't do it. I suffered long enough alone under the same roof with him, but we had a child that I had to take into account as well.

Either way I know how hard it is not wanting to hurt people and how terrible the guilt is that we put on ourselves during times like this. I hope you find peace in your choice.

Boy, do I second Bella_D's words, especially this part:

"I couldn't possbly guess the best decision for you, but whatever decision you make, try to make it based on rational thought, not lust. The lust you feel for the new guy will subside too, and you'll be left with, well, basically a boy who is just starting out in life, with many immature traits that will drive you nuts sometimes. "

What popular culture and popular "wisdom" tell us is that we have a right to be "happy" at all times, and sometimes this makes people think that they should go for whatever feels best right at the moment.

Like Bella_D says, right now your husband feels like an "old shoe" but chances are very good that the new guy could end up seeming like an "old shoe" eventually as well...

The fact of the matter is, I don't think we are meant to feel "in love" with someone together for the rest of our lives. Those who will disagree with me, 99% of the time, will be in 2-3 year relationships and thinking those feelings will last forever. I don't think this really happens, except possibly EXTREMELY rarely (and I mostly just think it's BS). We always hear that marriage is hard work, but what no one seems to tell us is that sometimes the hardest part of all is actually WANTING to make things work. Sometimes the hard work involves sacrificing the attentions and affections of an attractive diversion.

On the other hand... you need to determine if you truly, truly would be better off without your husband. Imagine your ym e-mails you today and says it's over, he wants no contact. What do you feel about leaving the husband now? Be completely honest with yourself. This is probably one of the biggest decisions of your life.

And make no mistake... ending a 9-year relationship and rushing off into someone else's arms is NOT going to be as easy as you think it is. You would be ending your entire way of life for a "maybe" -- it is just a maybe now, don't kid yourself! Everyone who falls in love just KNOWS things are different for them -- they usually aren't. Relationships with AMAZING beginnings often fizzle unexpectedly... add to that the fact that your ym is very young, and that makes it even more likely that one day he could wake up and say, "Thanks, it's been nice... later." And if he does stick around, it's almost guaranteed that when the initial honeymoon-esque phase wears off, you might be disappointed with him -- "I left a marriage for THIS?" -- and could end up resenting him, big time.

Best of luck... seriously, I do wish you the best. It sounds as though I'm all pro-marriage, but I'm not really. I'm just a realist.

""" On the other hand... you need to determine if you truly, truly would be better off without your husband. Imagine your ym e-mails you today and says it's over, he wants no contact. What do you feel about leaving the husband now? Be completely honest with yourself. This is probably one of the biggest decisions of your life. """

THE best determiner..... if you can answer that your marriage is still over, that life alone is better then alone in your marriage

I appreciate everyone's input. I have been struggling with all of these same thoughts. And I have been very honest with myself and my husband about needing more from a relationship than he and I have. I am not above "the grass is greener" syndrome, but in this case, when I look at my situation, I can honestly say that if my YM called today and said it wasn't what he wanted, I would not be rushing back into my husband's arms. I can remember crying to my mom 2 years ago about wanting to leave my husband but worrying b/c he has no family - MY parents are like his parents..and he is like a brother to me - that is how I love him. We had a pretty co-dependant relationship - he basically worked for me and it became like work was all we shared. We don't communicate well - I want to talk about everything and he is very quiet...if we did try to change things, it would be a difficult road and one that I am finding I am unable to give 100% to. So I guess that's it then...but it still sucks. We are like best friends and no one wants to screw over their best friend. I actually spend most of my time thinking about this situation independantly of the YM thing - but I know they get intertwined. It helps me to write things down, so sorry again for rambling..... :o

ramble all you want...what we are here for!

sounds like you have thought it out well...it was where i was in my 2nd marriage. we tried, but my heart was not in it. i chose to be alone, then to be in a marriage and be alone.

good luck to you...keep us updated

i sounds like you are well educated woman, maybe on some level your husband felt intimidated? i may be all wrong on that, but the way you describe him is not like that of a man you respect and sorry if i am wrong here but it my belief that men need to be looked up to or cherished or honored in some way that they feel that they are the ONLY man in their woman's life, not an employee, not a buddy, but the MAN in the relationship.

young men offer ALOT, i otta know, i married mine, but i got to tell you that i deeply respect my husband, i do look up to him despite a twenty year gap and trust his opinion over my own at times because of the character of his heart. i relish in the feeling that i really really like him as a man and as a person.

i had a disasterous marriage where there was no way to turn but out and then stayed single for years before meeting my husband, i am a firm believer that marriage is sacred and every stone needs to be turned before its time to call it a day, i truly wonder in your case if it is over if you can refer to your husband as a best friend??? isnt that a really good place to start any love affair? alot harder work, but after all these years you can still call him that is an accomplishment.

I agree with Bella D. and disagree with you on the soulmate crap. There's no such thing as a soulmate, I'm sure there are many a man and woman who've thought themselves a soulmate to the other on their wedding day or when they finally moved in together, but let's face, even on this site and the divorce rate being the rate it is, is evidence of the lies we tell ourselves so we can be with someone and not be alone. soulmate is a long term process, not a x week-we can talk about everything-boink to the stars-kind of wonder. its a work in process and if you can't work it with your husband, what makes you think you can work it with the ym after the honeymoon phase is over.

You make your husband sound like a great guy. He doesn't sound like he's been abusive physically or verbally, is he. Except he's not a talker, good grief, if you need to talk, call some girlfriends...He might've lost his way a bit, but so have you because you can never solve the problems in your marriage by turning to someone else. You just carry them with you. Remember, this ym doesn't live with you, right now you're just as much a new babe to him as he is to you. What happens when that novelty wears off. At this time of his young life, he has more choices then you do.

Kitty (bless her heart) said something amazing, she always does:
i truly wonder in your case if it is over if you can refer to your husband as a best friend??? isnt that a really good place to start any love affair? alot harder work, but after all these years you can still call him that is an accomplishment.

The hard work is when you can walk away from the relationship and walk out the door with no reservations, knowing that you put in 100% effort in making it work and not because some ym has cross your eye. You had no right to encourage this ym to an affair of his heart. Its not fair to him and if he's that young, you using your feminity to engage him in a relationship that you are not free to give 100% for and that's not fair. As Pinkcat says:
We always hear that marriage is hard work, but what no one seems to tell us is that sometimes the hardest part of all is actually WANTING to make things work. Sometimes the hard work involves sacrificing the attentions and affections of an attractive diversion.

You know, sometimes we have to learn the hard way, karma teaches us those lessons whether we want to or not. Either way, free up either men so they may find a woman who in a good place to love them completely, with just honour and emotional integrity. Dont keep your guilt from allowing your husband from finding someone who has no problems with the quiet type. Because if you can't feel a deep friendship even when you're quiet together, than it is YOU who doesn't know how to be a friend or soulmate, if you will.

Paris

I agree with Bella D. and disagree with you on the soulmate crap. There's no such thing as a soulmate, I'm sure there are many a man and woman who've thought themselves a soulmate to the other on their wedding day or when they finally moved in together, but let's face, even on this site and the divorce rate being the rate it is, is evidence of the lies we tell ourselves so we can be with someone and not be alone. soulmate is a long term process, not a x week-we can talk about everything-boink to the stars-kind of wonder. its a work in process and if you can't work it with your husband, what makes you think you can work it with the ym after the honeymoon phase is over.

You make your husband sound like a great guy. He doesn't sound like he's been abusive physically or verbally, is he. Except he's not a talker, good grief, if you need to talk, call some girlfriends...He might've lost his way a bit, but so have you because you can never solve the problems in your marriage by turning to someone else. You just carry them with you. Remember, this ym doesn't live with you, right now you're just as much a new babe to him as he is to you. What happens when that novelty wears off. At this time of his young life, he has more choices then you do.

Kitty (bless her heart) said something amazing, she always does:


The hard work is when you can walk away from the relationship and walk out the door with no reservations, knowing that you put in 100% effort in making it work and not because some ym has cross your eye. You had no right to encourage this ym to an affair of his heart. Its not fair to him and if he's that young, you using your feminity to engage him in a relationship that you are not free to give 100% for and that's not fair. As Pinkcat says:


You know, sometimes we have to learn the hard way, karma teaches us those lessons whether we want to or not. Either way, free up either men so they may find a woman who in a good place to love them completely, with just honour and emotional integrity. Dont keep your guilt from allowing your husband from finding someone who has no problems with the quiet type. Because if you can't feel a deep friendship even when you're quiet together, than it is YOU who doesn't know how to be a friend or soulmate, if you will.

Paris


You are too harsh. Life isn't always black and white as much as you like to think it is. If a person is quiet and doesn't share a part of himself then it's hard to get close to that person. Perhaps it's the other way around....maybe he should learn to express himself if he deserves a friend. Close yourself off and that is what you get....Oneself.

Irparis...Thank you for your blunt response, but I think it is difficult to know the details of my situation b/c I did not choose to inlcude some of them. My husband is not simply quiet, he is an emotional abyss...he will attest to that, and even though he is trying to communicate better, he has said I will have to accept that part or him, which I have considerd. Also, he is a daily pot smoker, which has made it difficult for me with trying to have a successful business with him supposedly being a "partner" in that...I am out doing emergencies at night, returning client phone calls and ordering supplies... and I have spent years defending him to other peope who see a disparity in the situation, b/c I DO appreciate what he has done...and he certainly has not been abusive, but he manages to have time to play World of Warcraft for at least 8 hours a day as well. I did not want to get whiny about his faults, b/c everyone has them and he IS my friend. He has helped me with my business for 6 years, during which time, what I really needed was more emotional support. An occasional "how was your day" or "how are you feeling" to which his response has always been - "i dont need to ask, you will tell me in exceptional detail" as he is talking on headphones to other people on his online RPG....I did not want to bring up my husband's issues b/c I was trying to deal with my own.

I do care about my husband and I DID try to get him to go to counseling and at least cut down on the smoking...he remindes me that from the beginning of our relationship he told me that he did not believe in counselig b/c he would never pay someone to listen to his problems, and he enjoys smoking...and I agreed - if it makes him happy, then he shouldn't give it up. But do I sacrifice what I need? SOME form of emotional stimulation and interaction other than conversations about work...maybe that does make me selfish and a bad partner...that is what I am trying to figure out. After all we have been through, I am continuing to support him while he goes back to school, b/c I WANT the best for him in every aspect of his life...and as Irparis pointed out, that obviously is not a selfish, uncaring person like myself...but I tried for years - I just recovered from cervical cancer, during which he still was emotionally shut off. It was only after he felt another MAN was involved that he got in touch with his emotions...does that make HIM the best person for me??? And you know what - I am okay with that because I do not think life is as black and white for some of us as it seems to be for Paris.

And as for the "crap" about soulmates...it often seems like a lot of people who are "sure" that soulmates don't exist have never found one. I have been blessed to have had 2...and although the first one was disrupted b/c we were both in veterinary school (we were together 12 years ago), when we spoke last year, he told me that I was still deep in him...and I cried, not from sorrow but from the joy of KNOWING that these cosmic connections transcend our physical relationshipss and experiences and that they DO last a lifetime, no matter where our paths take us. A quote I saw recently came from someone who I am sure HAS felt that cosmic bond/soulmate connection before... "There are people whom one loves immediatley and forever. Even to know they are alive in the world with one is quite enough" I do not have any expectations from this other person, other than wanting to embrace the experience for as long as it lasts. Again, that may make me the selfish, uncaring person Irparis pointed out. I have been trying to consider everyone else's feelings...I felt selfish in some ways and although it stings to have it stated the way Paris did, she may be correct and I am taking the comments to heart. Thanks again...

What does a well educated woman veterinarian need with a pot smoking, role playing, emotionally distant husband? What would you tell someone else who is in exactly your position?

I don't know if I believe in soul mates either but that is another story. This YM you've met has only magnified what you aren't getting in your marriage from your husband. I don't think you are ever going to get what you need from your husband. In all likelyhood, as the years go by you are going to get less and less of the nothing you are already getting, if you get my drift.

I would have been out of there a long time ago. I understand why you've stayed and allowed him to stay. If you break up your marriage, it should be because it's the right thing to do for YOU because of your so-called relationship with your husband. How you feel about the YM is really incidental. He just happened to open your eyes to what love and emotional support is supposed to look like.

I wouldn't put up with what you put up with from your husband. He's not partner material in my book. Looks like you put the bread on the table and he goes along for the ride. How do you have respect for him?

well it must have been hard for you to put in print but you did not disclose he was a drug user, so actually it sounds like you are second only after the pot. that does put a different light on things. the game you described is also a type of addiction, an excape from reality. even though someone says that they will never go to counciling, is not your promblem, actually he needs more than counciling he needs rehab, you have a choice here and can force an ultimatum, he may not want to go but thats on HIM not you. look for all those who say that no one can force someone to quit a drug, i say, this guy is in a fog and it is a last ditch effort for the poster to have exhausted truly all avenues before she may be free emotionally to really shut the door on this relationship, if he does not go then the consequence is HIS. put the responsiblity back on the one who claims to want the marriage and see if he is willing to pay the price. chances are he wont quit or go, then he made the choice and no one deserves to be second only to a drug.

the ym may be everything you say he is BUT you are still on the fence on whether or not it is time to divorce your husband.

like i said, i fell in love with my soul mate, (my definition is our SOULS are in unision, same faith, same belief system, our souls are entwined, in print many times i have mentioned that i love my husbands soul) but to burden that lovely relationship with a pendind divorce would have put such strain on my husband that i am not willing to give.

i am grateful that it was years after my divorce that we met, i carried SO much baggage but the ex was gone and no where on the horizon, i had time to heal and talk things thru with adam and let go of the pain and welcome the love that came into my life.

it seems to me that you have some hard decisions to make. take care and good luck.

Evonavet, it sounds like you found some of the advice we gave you a bit `off' and even harsh.

Please understand that the the scenario seemed very different the first time you described it, which changed from:

`My husband used to not talk much but since I met someone else he's much better now'........to `My husband is a long term pot/gaming addict and refuses to consider getting help'.

Do you see that as any reader, trying to muster up the best words of support for you, that ommitting certain vital information would cause others to see things very differently to yourself?

I actually agree with Paris's candid post as it applied to the situation you first described. But having added chronic drug addiction to the mix, I'm sure that you'd find most of the responses here very different. Noone intended to offend you' there just wasn't enough info supplied.

ANyhow...back to the point:)

Pot really `dumbs' a person down huh? Plus it completely de-motivates the user....I consider it horrible stuff when used regularly. And it must be frustrating living with that for a person with an active, if not brilliant mind such as yourself. I imagine you have moments of feeling quite lonely. And yet I can respect your choise....you are a healer by nature/vocation; I imagine that compassion and patience are deeply ingrained traits within your nature.

Hey if your husband is taking all sorts of desperate measures to win you back, why not ask him to give up pot? It seems to be the root of the marital problems you've described. Even if the marriage breaks up, if you can entice him to give up pot that would be soemthing good that came oput of the situation. ANyhow best of luck!

Also, he is a daily pot smoker Are you a weekend user? Is that why you left this info out at first? If so, then please try to stop so that you can make some good decisions about your life. If not, then great! You deserve a man that can be there emotionally as well as physically.

My YM is understanding of everything. Can you elaborate more about this?

Speaking of just my own experience. I was married for 22 years. He too was 'quite', which really means I never ever knew what he was thinking or feeling. I had tried numerous ways over the years to tell him what I needed from him, he never 'got it'. I finally made a decision that I wanted out of the marriage ... then I went back and forth in my mind, asking myself how do I just wipe out a 22 year relationship. So I made the choice that for myself, I would try one last time, and I told him this, and if it did not work out then our marriage was over. And no the time frame I put on working it out was not a short time, like a month or two, it was six months. I felt that was enough time if he was ever going to be able to talk to me, now was his chance to show at least some effort on his part. I was completely honest with him about how I was feeling.

I requested that he go to counseling with me. He refused. So I started counseling on my own. It helped to speak to someone that was not judgemental. My counselor also brought up 'things' that I probably would not have thought about, however once it was brought up, I did think about them.
One thing counseling does is as we change, it forces the people (read husband) around us to change as well. We don't have control over how they change, only how we change. So their reactions to our changes are solely theirs to own.

I don't think any of us here can tell you what is the right choice for you. You know you relationship far better then anybody. We can offer opinions, yet ultimately it is you that has to make the decisions.

In my case, the marriage ended. But for myself at least I knew I had tried everything, and I would not have any regrets wondering what if I had tried 'this or that'.

As many have mentioned, you need to make your choices about your marriage without the other man being in your life. It is not fair to your husband or the other man. As in either situation you can not offer 100% of yourself.

I wish you the best. Good luck!

IrParis....It was a difficult decision to include the pot smoking thing b/c my husband is a very private person and I didn't want to broadcast that info...but I defintitely asked him to give it up...several years ago, we lived in Arizona for 6 months - I worked at a low cost spay and neuter clinic and he had no source so to speak...and those were some of the best times. He felt better and was adamant that he did not want to go back to smoking when we moved home. Well, that lasted a few months....and I have never been one to force people to do things they don't want to - it ends up causing resentment usually. And as for myself...I am not a pot smoker, it makes me paranoid. I did get to a point where I drank more wine than I should have when we were in our lowest points, but that subsided when I started getting some emotional support and not feeling like I needed to be numb myself to get through each day. I haven't gotten a bottle of wine in months...I have no desire to be numb anymore!!!! And I was not offended by anyone's comments...like I said, I did omit some things and also have been struggling with every aspect of this situation for a while now. Counseling has helped me, my friends havehelped me and yes, the YM has helped me too. I am taking that situation slow as well, b/c IF (and I am aware it's a big if) this is something special, i DO have a ton of baggage to sort through. I just don't want to turn a very special person away b/c of "when" they came into my life....

Thanks again everyone, I truly do appreciate everyon'es opinion on this site :)

Well please keep us updated as to how you are doing. It sounds to me like you have tried to piece the marriage back together. And...that your husband is not a bad person just doesn't give you what you need emotionally. This is where the confusion comes in about wanting to leave him. Ya know if you have told him and he is not listening, then what can you do? Life is so short and it must be miserable to be married and still be alone. Personally, I would give him an ultimatum..stop the pot smoking as it is detrimental to our marriage or I'm leaving. Now mind you I said that's what I would do...you have to make your own decisions.

I think I understand your personality as it seems a lot like mine. You have lived miserably for fear of hurting him. Think about this..you hate hurting him so you hurt instead. Apparantly he hasn't thought that way, or he would be doing what you ask of him. You know he's not a bad person, just not what you want any more. (this part is me so I understand) You are very passive, easy going, and laid back. This is an enabler.

Correct me if I'm wrong in any of this..

Actually Sara, you are EXACTLY right....and it is really difficult to hurt someone who isn't being abusive, who is a good person and someone who I think I will always care about. I didn't want the discussion to turn into a referendum on my husband's shortcomings. I guess I am just insecure with my own decision making process sometimes, even though I have known for a while where this would end up. I have a letter in my journal from September that I wrote to my husband when we were splitting up, telling him the things he did that DID make me happy, and I asked him to stop smoking and consider going to counseling with me. He did not want to do that. He did make an effort to cut back on the smoking at first and I don't know if it was passive/agressive of me, but I told him he needed to do that for himself, not for me b/c he might resent it later....within a week he was back to pre-discussion levels and I took that a sign that either he could not or did not want to stop. It is just sad...that's all I guess. I am sure he has some depression issues, abandonment issues...he was neglected as a child. I know I can't be a martyr and fix him, but still....it just sux. Overall though, it's not as bad as I'm making it sound right now when i get all whiny. He IS going back to school, he and I are not at odds over material possessions or anything. So I just need to reassure myself that he will get through this too. And hopefully we will both be happier and better partners in the future. :)

Actually Sara, you are EXACTLY right....and it is really difficult to hurt someone who isn't being abusive, who is a good person and someone who I think I will always care about. I didn't want the discussion to turn into a referendum on my husband's shortcomings. I guess I am just insecure with my own decision making process sometimes, even though I have known for a while where this would end up. I have a letter in my journal from September that I wrote to my husband when we were splitting up, telling him the things he did that DID make me happy, and I asked him to stop smoking and consider going to counseling with me. He did not want to do that. He did make an effort to cut back on the smoking at first and I don't know if it was passive/agressive of me, but I told him he needed to do that for himself, not for me b/c he might resent it later....within a week he was back to pre-discussion levels and I took that a sign that either he could not or did not want to stop. It is just sad...that's all I guess. I am sure he has some depression issues, abandonment issues...he was neglected as a child. I know I can't be a martyr and fix him, but still....it just sux. Overall though, it's not as bad as I'm making it sound right now when i get all whiny. He IS going back to school, he and I are not at odds over material possessions or anything. So I just need to reassure myself that he will get through this too. And hopefully we will both be happier and better partners in the future. :)


Well you sound like a good person also and deserve to be happy. I do hope the best for you and I feel you will make the decision based on taking in to account everyone's feelings.

Eponavet, first of all, I get the impression that you and your husband are no longer living together. Is that the case? If you are still living together, I think you need to either move out or get your husband to move out before you pursue a relationship with anybody else. To me, for most couples, the real emotional divorce comes when somebody gets the motivation to actually move out. I don't think anybody has any business pursuing another relationship as long as they're still living under the same roof with a spouse -- it's not fair to the spouse, themselves, or the other person.

But if you're no longer living under the same roof with your husband, I think your decision on whether to get back together with him should be entirely separate from how you feel about the YM. If you would be willing to give your marriage another chance if the YM didn't exist, then I think you owe it to yourself to give it a try now -- and if the YM is worthwhile, he would understand that. But if you wouldn't be inclined to get back together with your husband in any event because you think the relationship is irretrievably broken, then don't let feeling sorry for your husband (and that's a lot of what I'm hearing) persuade you to do it. It would be a bad idea in any event, and it might well deprive you of what could be a good relationship.

I've been somewhat in your position. My first marriage only lasted between 2 and 3 years, at least in terms of the time we lived together, and at the time my ex-wife started talking about maybe wanting to get back together after all, we had been separated for almost a year and although I wasn't seriously involved with anybody else at the time, I was much happier not being in a relationship where we hadn't been able to communicate (she was also the "silent treatment" type who refused to cooperate in counseling) during almost the entire time we had been married and living together. I met my current wife less than a year after the divorce was final and we've been married for 30 years, and I'm certainly happy that I didn't let what would clearly have been a very temporary reconciliation prevent me from having the last 30 years. And in many respects, my ex-wife was a very admirable person with no "bad habits" such as substance abuse -- she was just emotionally absent and unwilling to do anything about it until it was obvious that I was much happier out of the relationship (even though the separation was completely agreeable to her at the time I moved out).

From what you've said, even without the drug use by your husband, it sounds like there wasn't much left to your marriage. If that's the case, and you don't think your husband is really able to change (which he probably isn't if he didn't have any real desire to change until he saw that you were happier with somebody else), then it seems to me that trying to get back together would do nobody any real good. Perhaps he'll get his own life together when he doesn't have you as a crutch to lean on anymore.

i respectfully dissagree on one of the poster's comments. a marriage is a partnership, in that partnership basic rules are established, like no cheating, no lieing, no stealing, no physical harm. if any of these rules are broken the person who has had the harm done has a right to make ground rules, yes-sir-ee-bob. i think you can put your foot down on the drug use, its sucked your marriage dry, to say you are not one to force him to face his problem is enabling him to put his screwed up behavior back on you.

passive aggressive, yes. i understand i am the SAME way, somehow i grew kahona's with my present love and husband. i think i had been stepped on so much by my ex's that i had an explosion of sorts.

my husband deeply respects me and when i say no way, i mean it, course, i also bend over backwards for him also and he see's that, but when we get into little mind flubs, i put an end to it. course, i am no angel either but i have been manipulated for SO long that even the slightest tinge gets me kookoo.

its hard to see the forest from the tree's when you are in the middle of the forest, but i think you would feel better about things if you looked at your part in it and maybe set some ground rules, zero tolerance for pot.

Yellowrose - my YM has been understanding of the fact that my husband has worked with me for 6 years and that I not only feel obligated, but also that I want to help him with getting his own life back together. I am paying for him to go back to school (we agreed on a 2 year degree program at the local community college) and he will still work 2 days a week in my veterinary practice. I know some people will express concerns about this and I understand, but I will elaborate a little on this. My husband has been not only my vet tech fo 6 years, but I also taught him how to do equine chiropractic adjustments. I am a small person - 100lb and horses' pelvises require a good amount of strength and height to adjust them. My practice is focused on the performance horse. I do ALOT of acupuncture and chiropractic work and he is a great asset to both the horses and myself. We have discussed him continuing to work as an independant contractor for me just to do the pelvic adjustments even after he finishes school. He knows he is good at it and he really loves working with the horses as well. So, my YM has had no problem with knowing that I am not going to abandon my husband after he helped get my practice to be as successful as it is.

I am choosing a different path for my life and in doing so, I am in some ways, taking away a lifestyle my husband enjoyed (and in some ways took advantage of, but not to any extreme - we both allowed the personal aspect of our relationship to deteriorate). If the situation with the YM progresses, he wants to know he comes first, beyond that, he is not concerned with my husband (ex...ASAP) being in our life in some fashion. For example, like he said, maybe my ex will get a present or a hug at Christmas or whatever, but HE (YM) will be going home with me and that's what he wants...to him, I AM the present :) He is really a great person who I DO have so much respect for...we have connected in so many ways but I know its still too soon to know if it will last. But he has helped me remember how things SHOULD be...as have many of the people here at Ageless - kittylane is an inspiration for sure!!! - and I thank you all very much!!!

Did I miss the age gap on this one somewhere? I was just curious about your age and your YM.

Funny isn't it how you don't realize how dysfunctional a situation is until you've been shown "normal"??? Then you're like....Whoa!! This is how a relationship works. :)

And yes, Kittylane is a true inspiration. So kind and loving.

:o Sara - in my first post on this thread I mentioned my YM was legal, but not by much...he is only 18 and I am 35. I am very aware of the VYM issues, but in this case, at least for now, he has acted more mature than me, my husband - or anyone else I have ever been involved with. He is the "old soul" type and his family is pretty supportive of our situation - they also consider him to be quite different from most people his own age. Again, I am taking it slow....I am trying not to put arbitrary time frames on things, but I really want to live alone for about a year - I just need space and time to myself. If visits with my guy go well, we will go from there. For now - we are getting to know each other and every day has been amazing. Our conversations have always been very fulfilling, whether we are talking about philosophy or spiritual matters, politics or just joking around. He makes me laugh, he makes me feel like a better person and he says I do the same for him. I'm gushing now.... :) But it is nice, even if it it changes in the future, as some of these OW/YM relationships do. I wanted to thank everyone one more time....this site is wonderful!!!

just curious, where in florida are you? i am in broward county (south florida)

and it is really difficult to hurt someone who isn't being abusive, who is a good person and someone who I think I will always care about This isn't about your husband's shortcomings. He is a full fledge drug addict and will be abusing your marriage because of that one fact. Drug addicts only care about themselves and their relationship with their drug. Everything else is secondary.

Whether you stay with him or not, I would encourage you to try Ala-non. It will further your knowledge about yourself and your care-taking personality, so that you will not be as inclined to take on new "projects" in the future. :)

Congrats also on seeing your own 'numbing' out and doing something about it as well. Given all that you are going through, I can totally understand why you were doing so. But it takes a clear head to make these major decisions doesn't it?

You sound like a wonderful person... I hope you hang around awhile with us!

Kittylane - I live in north Florida, north of Gainesville. I don't know if you will check this thread, but I saw that you had carcinoma in situ and are doing well after a leep procedure. That's really great news!! I had a hysterectomy last year - invasive squamous cell carcinoma of the cervix. Luckily, I have had 3 clear paps and hopefully won't have to have any radiation or additional treatments :)

I should ad that from what has been seen and experienced on Ageless, most relationships with VYM (age 18-25) fail. There are exceptions, but these aren't the norm. My hope for you is that your decisions about your marriage will be made w/o the influence of this other ym. And if you are seeing him, or even dreaming/hoping about him, you are being influenced by him. I think this is so sad for you. Clarity is hard to find when your heart is being torn.
Ali

Actually, it isn't so sad for me to have realized that I needed more from a relationship than what I was getting from my marriage - things that both my husband and I failed to do to make it work. What is kind of sad is that for many people, I'm sure not just for myself, we often stay in situations that are not fulfilling....and I do wish I had been strong enough to see it without having been influenced by another person. I don't think I am unique in becoming complacent, and I hope to improve that aspect of myself by being more present with my emotions every day. That being said, I try to learn form every experience and accept my shortcomings and try to improve in the future. Dreaming of a better relationship - of being a better person for myself and a better partner for whomever I am involved with is something I embrace. I have spent a lot of time - with my own thoughts and in counseling - realizing that it is almost impossible to figure everything out in some kind of monastic environment - independant of the people around you - family, friends, SO's...it is all intertwined. If we don't dream and aspire to be happy, no one else will do it for us. :)

That wasn't my understanding at the beginning. yes, if your husband smoking pot constantly, that is quite different. I find pot can most times be just as addictive as smoking, I wouldn't call it drug abuse...(have you read what they put in cigarettes lately...and its just as addictive but its so socially acceptable we don't even think about the addictive components).

It becomes abusive when they can't get through the day without its properties in their bodies. I'm sorry for my bluntness but as you describe it the first time, it did not seem such a horrid situation. But you've allowed this vym to establish himself in your life thereby now, not giving this marriage a fair shot because he has awaken you to see the faults within an already established relationships. I'm sorry but an 18 yr old at that...ha...I'm sorry, I'm 46, apart from being a great boinkers, I have no use for most 18 yr olds. as they are still consider a teenagers until their 20 and too flighty at worse.

Tell me, what drew you to your husband to begin with. Was he always this quiet? Why did you marry him if he told you that he wasn't going to quit his pot smoking? What were your expectations going into the marriage? There must've have been some redeeming qualities that drew you to this man?

look, I'm not telling you to stay or go, its not my place... you have to come to that decision on your own and for the good of you both, not so you can go and play house with some other guy, even if its in a year. You've gotta walk away from this with a clear head and it doesn't seem like you're there yet or you would've been gone and you wouldn't have needed our advice, not by a long shot. Which I think RedDiasy advice is good:
One thing counseling does is as we change, it forces the people (read husband) around us to change as well. We don't have control over how they change, only how we change. So their reactions to our changes are solely theirs to own.

As Dr Wayne Dyer states: When you change the way you look at things, the things you look at change. Relationships and the behaviours within those relationships are a constant negiotation. If you can't negiotate within this marriage which is a concentrated effort beyond dating and living together, for me, what makes you think that YOU will be a good negiotator with any new relationship. i wonder why your husband does not feel motivated enough to want to talk to you and smoking pot is perferably. There's something there that he doesn't feel comfortable in talking to you, he doesn't trust you with his feelings. That would bother me, because eventually the honeymoon with this vym will be over and what if you bring the same issues to the new relationship. How about a Marriage Encounter weekend? He doesn't necessarily talked to someone, but he may listen to and be inspired by the whole concept of marriage.

well, you have strength, I'm sure you will harness that strength and make the best possibly decision for you. But do it with a clear head, that you know you left no stone unturned. You owe it to both of you.

Paris

eponavet...
Wisdom on the way here....
If you decide to divorce your husband and "be" with your ym, make SURE you do not hang your hat on your ym making you happy for the long haul. Statistically, it just won't happen. And, from personal experience with many OW on the boards here, it won't either. Three to four out of the hundreds of posting members here at Ageless have maintained a long term relationship of more than 5 years with a vym that was in the 18-19 year range when it started. Only 3 or 4 !!!! There are reasons for that fact ,most are based on the developmental and life experience levels of a vyp in general. Age DOES matter when it is about digits under the 20-year range.

Your story read like mine....except I was married for 20 years, hadn't been physically intimate for the last 5, no communication except a "hi, how are you?" as we passed in the hallway of our home occassionally, he didn't have a pot-smoking problem nor was he abusive (unless you call controlling me passive-aggressively and lying abuse)...but he did have a secret gambling/credit debt/porn obsession for years before I found out. I suggested counseling, he went once...I begged, pleaded for emotional intimacy from him, never got it. Our marriage was just truly, utterly DEAD.

Enter K...my 18 year old confidant/soulmate/old soul/ most amazingly mature person I'd ever known (sound familiar?). We fell hard for each other after fostering a solid friendship, I told my husband (during our separation mode), and he wanted to stay..make things work. Too late. We didn't get divorced for another 18 months, and the whole time was misery....I simply wanted to be with my ym. He told me he loved me more than life, he wrote poetry that was amazing (one poem entitled "Osmosis" that uses the metaphor of our souls blending and communing as one...like water molecules during osmosis). I mean he was everything I wanted/needed in a man. And he COMMUNICATED like no other...we shared everything: our art, our business, our spiritual beliefs, our intellect. He wanted to be with me forever. I was the perfect woman for him, he said he loved me every day, etc.

The divorce finally went through...another 2 years passed, and suddenly it seemed, K was confused now. :( He was not as sure that we should be together in the future...he began back- pedaling on all his "promises" of undying love. I HAD hung my hat on the words and actions of his 18-19-20 year old self...but then he became an adult who's mind had evolved. He hadn't purposefully misled me all those years (almost 4 in total), he just ...well....grew up... and had more clarity about what he wanted for his future, I guess. Didn't we ALL do that? I mean, decisions we made at 18 were long gone and changed by 21. Heck, I changed my college major 3 times between 18-21, and had 3 major relationships (each one was my "soulmate" at first, of course).

What I'm saying here is....divorce your husband if you marriage is over (you know if it is); but don't put all your eggs in the vym basket. Be single for a while, get counseling yourself, date others along with the vym maybe.

Tread cautiously and guard your heart. If you two are still seeing each other when he is 23, chances are good that he is one of those exceptionally RARE vym who actually knows what he wants for the rest of his life at 18.

Best,
Karen

Paris - my husband doesn't feel comfortable talking to anyone. It comes from being neglected as a child. His mother didn't speak to her children really - she spoke through her dogs to them...weird, but days would go by and no talking. She cooked dinner for herself and not her kids - my husband eats peanut butter sandwiches....almost every meal. Never eaten a vegetable in 9 years. Yes he was quiet when we met. I think in some ways I thought he would eventually open up more - I always expressed I wanted better, deeper communication. He never tried to be something he is not. Like I said, I like to talk about eveything - TOO much, too intensely, overanalysing etc. He is Zen-like to the point of appearing uncaring, even though I know he cares. That is part of the problem and part of my struggle - I will hurt myself in some ways to keep from hurting him, even though being with someone when your heart isn't 100% into it DOES hurt them. I am not saying I am this angel that flies around being a martyr every day. I made a billion mistakes - it was a slow downward spiral that we both see now in hindsight...it isn't a pretty picture for either of us.

Now, the VYM...it is a lot like the situation K describes. And I am just like every other person on the planet probably when it comes to the honeymoon or in love feeling...everyone wants to find that special someone and have it work. But I am also like almost every other woman (OW) when it comes to the insecurities and thought process about actually being with such a young person. I tell my self, as well as him - the same things K mentioned - I actually don't know anyone who is living anywhere near the life they expected/wanted etc when they were 18. I was an art major, working in a bookstore with no serious thoughts of being a veterinarian. At that age, there are so many experiences and changes...I may be his first love, but do I honestly think I'll be his last....no. If I feel that way, should I go ahead and turn away now? I am not blinded by love, but I am not as cynical yet as some of the people here who have already been through a relationship like this and haven't had it work. I am probably a "glass half empty" person more that half full....but - and I know I will get some serious criticism about being selfish here for this - I also am a person who thinks life should be lived...with its ups and downs. Whether I get 1 month, 1 year or 100 hundred years with someone I love - it all is part of the process. I am working on myself, on learning to actually feel and express my emotions in a healthy way - I am doing this because I wasn't being fully present in the past. Will it make me a better person and a better partner - I hope so. Will it make me happy - I hope so. Will it make me perfect - OF COURSE!!!! :D j/k...

hey, thank God you are ok, i have had one good pap and am gonna go again next month to check again, i go every three months, but if it gets weird again, i am going for the hysterectomy also, we had the same thing but mine was not invasive? it was just on the skin of the cervix? i took my results to another doctor to make sure, it seems some doctors dont mess around and go for the hysterectomy, i am hoping that i made the right choice, but as i said, i am on top of it. both of the doctors i went too said i could do the leep and then come back to make sure that no cells were left behind. thats what i am doing.

i was all set to move to ocala this year and the medical stuff and the HURRICANES screwed everything up, i am very close to my daughter and grandson's and they were coming with me but they ended up staying in south florida so in a way i feel STUCK.

i am a realtor and the rat race is extreme here, i wanted a slower pace that northern florida offers.

honestly, the hubby is a communications specialist with satellites and computers, he has many opportunites if he stays in the field in the private sector so i wonder about that also, he also wanted northern florida but is close to my daughters boys also and does not want to leave them behind either.

thanks for the update and i hope we stay in touch. take care.

He is Zen-like to the point of appearing uncaring Sweetie, that Zen could be just the Pot. :p

You probably moved too quickly into this relationship. Don't feel bad, I have done that many many times. I still tend to it!

What about just separating and going to a therapist? It is time for you to discover YOU. Then you will see more clearly what you want in life.

""" On the other hand... you need to determine if you truly, truly would be better off without your husband. Imagine your ym e-mails you today and says it's over, he wants no contact. What do you feel about leaving the husband now? Be completely honest with yourself. This is probably one of the biggest decisions of your life. """

THE best determiner..... if you can answer that your marriage is still over, that life alone is better then alone in your marriage

This is key.

The divorce finally went through...another 2 years passed, and suddenly it seemed, K was confused now. He was not as sure that we should be together in the future...he began back- pedaling on all his "promises" of undying love.

Special K, I have a book which is dedicated to this examing this phenonemon.

Apparently it is not uncommon for people who have chosen `unavailable' partners, to leave the relationship when true availablity presents itself. Some of the case studies in the book include long term affairs which ended when the married partner finally got divorce to be with their lover; long distance relationships which ended when the couple were finally able to live together....those kinds of scenarios.

I guess maybe its kind of useful to know that some people choose married/unavilable partners because there's an emotional hook in there somewhere which appeals to their fears of intimacy. They actually chose the situation because `unavailablity' is soemthing they seek out, even if it doesn't register with their conscious minds.

Anyway, who knows how, or if, this would apply to a VYM? From a young guy's perspective, I imagine its easy enough to get caught up in the `victory' of winning over another man's woman, or in the prospect of gaining certain advantages & financial comfort by attracting someone older and much more successful than himself.

I do agree with epoavet; soemtimes we can only learn about people from giving thema chance. I just hope this won't be a case of going from the frypan into the fire, in terms of finding herself back where she was....supporting a guy who has no career or incentive of his own.

Yellowrose - I have often thought that the detachment/ laid back attitude of my husband comes a lot form the chronic pot smoking. He was much more interactive when he stopped for that six months we were in Arizona. At this point in his life, he does not want to quit - we have discussed it many times. We separated almost 6 months ago and I have been in therapy for almost 8 months now. I was feeling really great about my choices in general - about changing my veterinary practice for the better, about having some time for myself, even though I was talking to this YM. It was AFTER we were separated and then my husband expressed a desire to work on things that this became a "Difficult Situation" thread... :)

But my stomach would get into a knot whenever I would think about continuing to try and the progress I made in therapy backslid some, although I was better at recognizing my feelings in a more timely fashion (weeks, not months to years... :o ) But I still felt like a jerk for wanting to move on. I am getting past that, because at this point in MY life, I AM going to take time for myself. I also have slowed things down a bit with my YM - in the sense that I talked to him about exactly what you said - about WANTING to have some space and time to recover and also to continue therapy so I can still be a caring partner without becoming a "caretaker". I am still going to go visit him next month - it will only be our second visit, and I told him even if it is wonderful, between my work and my recent separation, it will be several months before I would be in a position to plan another visit (even if he wants to make the trip to see me). It may be a typical YM response, but he is being very supportive without being pressuring, he thinks it is a good idea for me to know what I want and has expressed more than once if I feel the need to try again with my husband, he would definitely understand. But - I don't...and I guess the "Difficult" part of this whole thread was coming to terms with that - accepting it and not feeling so guilty about my decision that I stayed in a situation that was not fulfilling for either person. I want to thank everyone again - you guys are great...I told Paris I should be paying her instead of my therapist :p I will keep posting b/c this is a wonderful site and I am enjoying getting to know so many interesting people!!

Sorry to kinda bump this thread but...what Bella wrote reminded me of something. I think I posted once about a Dentist in my town that had a wife diagnosed at about age 25 with MS. Anyway, it was word around town that he was having an affair with his receptionist. Move ahead 20 yrs. or maybe even 25. His wife lived a long time but was very incapacitated. But he stayed with her helping to raise their two boys. Several yrs. ago she passed away. Last week I went to a Chamber of Commerce meeting in my town that I'm on a committee for...well, the Dr. and the receptionist walked in together. He announced I would like to introduce everyone to Mrs. ****. I know my jaw dropped. I was actually happy for him, he had carried a real load for yrs. taking care of the boys, her, and running his practice. Apparantly the other woman thought he was worth waiting for 20-25 yrs. I do believe this situation would definately be in the minority though. I would judge now the Dr. and her are around age 50. :)

However, when I actually went to go visit this other person and it was the most amazing experience ever...then all of a sudden, my husband wants to work things out.

My ex tried the same thing on me...but after we'd been separated for two months because he cheated on me. When he realized that he'd lost me, then suddenly he wanted to be all that I needed in a man.

Unfortunately for him, he never was and never will be and that was over three years ago.

Since you remain friends with your husband, work with him, and don't seem to be mentioning actively pursuing a divorce, then I think it's unfair to the new guy that you lead him on while still in doubt over your new and improved husband.

I'm going to read the replies from others now...but I strongly suggest you figure out which guy you want before doing any more visiting.

To understand is hard. Once one understands, action is easy....

This one is going on the fridge :D

But I still felt like a jerk for wanting to move on. Look, it sounds like he is a pot addict and he places his pot smoking over your marriage. So do not feal like a jerk. You can't have a relationship when his PRIMARY relationship is with his drug. Wish you the best...

Special K, I have a book which is dedicated to this examing this phenonemon.

Hmmm, BellaD....I've read the same book, I think ;) ... I know it's assertions and believe it's probably true in a general sense when there is cheating going on...interesting, but I don't believe it applies in my case, or in the hundreds of other cases where vym left an OW because he became "confused" after he grew up a bit and into his own autonomy. Young people becoming adults are allowed to change their minds on their journey toward maturity. We all did many times, didn't we? I don't think there are any of us OW here who are happily with the same person we fell in love with when we were 18 or 19. It happens, but rarely...and that's because PEOPLE INHERENTLY CHANGE THE MOST as "adults" during those very young-adult years. I wanted to believe that K was fully mature and knew what he wanted for the long haul at 19-20 (which he said was me for all those years)...he certainly seemed mature, intelligent and confident enough in his choice to be with me back then... But, alas, he was indeed genuine, but not experienced in life enough to really make a long term decision of that magnitude.

K and I were friends long before we fell in love, and were together nearly 4 years, almost 3 years after the divorce. The years after the divorce was final were when he was most comitted, wanting to marry me right away (he suggested eloping a few times...I dragged my feet, not him), etc. Neither did he have any fears of intimacy ( quite the opposite, actually).

Fact is....people change their minds exponentially-especially about the direction of their lives- between the ages of 18-21. That's what K did, as do most vyp. K had some palpable nobility during the breakup process that prooved to me beyond a doubt that I wasn't just some "conquest" for him.... He had loved me, but he was moving on toward a different chapter in his life...

The relationship prooved to be a learning experience for him (and for me). One I feel blessed and am thankful to have had.

It's kinda funny...my oldest son turns 19 next month, and he has recently fallen head over heels for a girl (same age). She is "perfect", "totally gets him", "has everything he wants in a woman", etc. I smile, and nod my head, and encourage him to be a gentleman and a great friend first as the foundation of their relationship....but I pretty much know that statistically and developmentally this girl will most likely be replaced by another one if not sooner, then later. Why? Not because my son is a player, or disingenuious, or taking advantage of a situation, or looking for a conquest (she was dating someone else when they first realized their friendship was heading somewhere closer to romance)....they are just very young. They will learn and grow from their time together, but be someone entirely more mature and different when they are 25 after adult life experiences have made more of a mark.

Eponavet I have read this thread with interest. A couple of wee points:

While your husband now says he wants to work on things keep in mind that for some people change is so incremental as to be quite worthless in the bigger picture. What you may want from a relationship may be faaaaaaaaar and beyond what your husband could give you even after another five years of working on stuff. Many people are very set in their basic personality and ways of relating and for them working on means tweaking a bit here and there.. I think the issues that bother you are bigger than that.

If he's not willing to give up the pot that says a lot about how much he values the relationship. He values his relationship with the pot more. I have a friend in just this situation, she is staying with him because he's a good man and she loves him. However it is a gaping wound for her that if the choice came down to him smoking pot every day and her leaving or him giving it up so she stayed it would be the pot every time. Drugs can truly be as bad as an affair as far as stealing the loyalties of the one you are with. Just knowing the pot will always come first erodes even a strong love; I would not be surprised if my friend wakes up one day to find the erosion has been happening for a long time.. probably when she meets someone else (not idle speculation, she kind of expects things to run like this).

If he's not willing to give up the pot that says a lot about how much he values the relationship. Standing ovation!!!! :cool:

i know...and I have been feeling good about things lately. Everyone who posted replies to my situation has helped, my counseling sessions help and going out with my girlfriends has helped :) They have reminded me that my husband has had YEARS to get it together...that it might have been okay to smoke pot some when he was 21, but at some point he should have grown WITH me...not still be lingering in a THC haze. My friend Erika actually thinks my husband would benefit from a harsher reality check than he is getting...HER husband left her 2 months after she had major back surgery (he couldn't go that long without sex I guess...). She was still hobbling around, with a farm to take care of and a ton of bills he never paid. However, I honestly consider my husband a friend and I could never just kick him to the curb. I am comfortable with my decision to help him get his life on track - although I am not sure if he hasn't done it yet that he ever will. He starts classes in summer session - I agreed to pay for school and pay the mortgage on his house (we own 2 houses - he moved to Gainesville house and payment is only $350). He has agreed to either work part time for me or get a part time job in Gainesville to pay his other expenses. I know, I know - it is like pushing a teenager out of the nest...and still helping them get by. And I am not blind to the irony of the other side of my coin...that the other person IS a teenager *sigh* :o Feel free to chime in on this topic if anyone wants to...I am okay with things, but as sara mentioned a while back - I am kind of an enabler and in some ways I am still doing that with my husband. But I feel so much like I can't - I won't - abandon him after he did spend 6 years helping me build a successful business. Things get really gray sometimes....but if I can sleep at night and I am working on myself...maybe worrying about the outcome won't freak me out so much.

An aside - I am reading a really good book (courtesy of my therapist) called "The Dance of Fear - Rising above Anxiety, Fear and Shame to be your Best and Bravest Self"....it is a really good book :)

Eponavet,

I don't entirely agree with the concept of `enabling' because it shifts some of the blame off of the person who is making all the choices regarding their own life. You're not responsible for that; he is.

However I agree with your friend who says you're not being assertive enough. I also think you're not backing up your views about pot use with actions(either as a lover or an employer)....in fact you actions have supported and protected his habit. You've even provided the lifestyle for him where he can avoid facing consequences for his pot use and lack of motivation.

I mean it probably registers somewhere in his mind that you don't agree with his pot use, but the bigger message is communicated through your actions, which support his lifestyle.....in fact nurture and provide it to him.

I've personally seen pot-heads, smokers, drinkers, and even heroin addicts give up their habits for women they love. But these women didn't tread lightly. They made ultimatums, had hissy fits, and refused to put up with what they didn't want in the relationship.. Some guys really do make the right choice when faced with the prospect of abandonment from someone they love.

But you've got to be strong enough and assertive enough to back up your words with actions. You have to be prepared to walk away...not only as a lover, but as an employer who requires your employee to be alert and drug free.

Your partner isn't your son and he doesn't need you to provide for him.
He can provide for himself, but he has to figure out for himself that its going to come down to making a choise between a real life or being a pot-head the rest of his life. Your `protection' of him has only robbed him of becoming a man that you could possibly love in the long term, and of facing his responsibility to himself to fullfill his goals and dreams.

I guess what I'm suggesting is that no matter what guilt you're experiencing, stop tolerating what you find intolerable. Stop treating him like a kid and let him fall hard and then find his way. And stop letting him be a burdeon on you.

I'd think twice about employing him too until he's drug free. If you really want to help a friend witha serious drug problem, these are sorts of measures you need to take. The `lighter touch' just doesn't work, as I'm sure you know.

This may not be a total comparison to your situation because of the "pot" issue. I stayed married to my husband 26 years. We were in one of those Dead marriages. He died last year (he was 16 years older). I met a ym, unfortunately I hate to admit, right before he died. My grown children say to me: you are selfish, you were just using Daddy, you never loved him, you just stayed because it was easier to raise your family with his financial support than to make it on your own. I wonder sometimes was it true that I used him. I don't remember saying I love you to him, and I remember him saying it to me once, right near the end. I would say what a good man he was, etc. I still appreciate many things about him. I thought he & I were doing the "right" thing by staying together. but I wonder what kind of loving, affectionate, communitative, real relationship I might have had if I had had the courage to leave. We can't go back in life, we can only go forward. I did not read all of your replies. Your situation sounds like an emotional roller coaster. I sincerely hope you will find an answer and feel at peace. It's tough to compare a rational decision with one that involves the heart. Maybe we always have to wonder if we did the right thing, I know I do.

eponavet,

I have hesitated to chime in on this subjuct but, i do have to say something.. he was 'with you" during this 6 years of building the business but was he really "helping you" or just along for the ride?

I have to tell you my heart hurts for you and all you are going through. I understand what you are going through, i am building a business myself for the second time. I lost it all the first time to the Ex that was "helping me out" and much the same way as your husband..

I hope you get clear of all this a much better person on the other end. Personally though, as hot as your feelings are for the YM he will wind up being a rebound for you and having the stress to deal with and the resulting emotional wreckage. If you care for him at all, you should consider this too.