Still interviewing, love to hear your story

Hello again ageless friends,

I am getting along fine with my book project and am still looking for anyone who is willing to participate anonymously. I am looking for guys and gals, serious, secret or cougar type relationships (there must be some of you hot ladies out there).

Thanks to those who have helped me to date. It will be somewhat of a road, but it's certainly getting there.

Tracy (Intime)

e-mail tracyinfl@excite.com or pm on ageless ;)

Whatever do you mean?

You're at the wrong site. Do you not do any research? I think mebbe you could just read Penthouse Forum and make up the rest as you go for your "book"

Oh for pete's sake people, search her other posts first before snapping to a judgement.

She's in a relationship, she's writing about relationships. Not a spammer, or a thrill seeker.

Calm down.

sorry, I'm intensly emotional right now. I saw cougars, and what was it hot babes or something and I got upset

Intime, I do not know about the others here, but you should know how we here at ageless think about "cougars" as you have been here long enough. THAT is the type of thinking we are trying to disspell here about ow/ym hence, that part of your "research" does not set too well with me. However, I know we do have a few of those here, but they are more than likely "secret" for they know how we feel about them. If this is to be a "positive" book age gap relatiopnships, then anything other than that really negates that idea. BUT if it is more like an "objective" one, then all the good, bad, and ulgy will definitely be "hung out to dry" so-to-speak for all to see. IT is just that from this group, I sincerely hope only the "good" would surface. With all due respect, you may need to go to other places to find the "bad and the ugly". And finally what has kept me from writing you is that I do not really want to be associated with anything that does not look at these type of relationships kind and healthy manner. Sorry...

Regards...

PS Trueheart, since older women are really not your thing, you may not know the term, cougar. But it is a negative one, for the most part, that means a woman is on the prowl to get a younger man (her prey) for sex only and/or to boost her ego.

Thank you Bella for acknowledging my post. Yes, Suicide, I realize at Ageless it is not nice to bring up the term Cougars. However, as my agent says, if it walks like a duck....

I've come up with a much more accepted term for us OW that are involved with YM, you are going to love it. But, I'm keeping it under wraps under the release of my book. I'm not a Cougar Suicide. Believe me. That is the hook of my book. I'm going to rip that reference apart.

Now, does anyone else want to comment? Of course I'm an Ageless member and abhor that term.

Stay tuned.

Tracy (Intime)

If so, would you please rewrite your request to explain what you need, what type of questions will be asked, and how.

Thank you Bella for acknowledging my post. Yes, Suicide, I realize at Ageless it is not nice to bring up the term Cougars. However, as my agent says, if it walks like a duck....



every younger man i've dated asked me out first, i have never cougar-ed...;)
i bet a lot of the women here are the same...
it just seems weird 2 me to go after any guy...whether i'm 20, 30 or 43!! so just because i'm 43 doesn't now mean i'm going 2 go "out on the prowl!!" that is soooooo lame!!! :D
i hope your book does depict scenarios where the youger man is the agressor as that has been this "ow's" experience...

What kind of research are you doing, other than trying to extrapolate information from ageless members? Since it's been mentioned to you repeatedly that this isn't a sight for "cougars" and that "secret relationships" are not condoned or considered healthy by members here, you must be doing research elsewhere.

Do tell. What kind of statistical analysis are you doing? What are your sample sizes and how do you determine if they are statistically significant? What cross section of the population do they come from? What are you going to draw your conclusions from? How do you make the determination that you are analyzing subjectively?

Merely telling stories is just that. We all have our own story. But I would be interested in what a social psychologist had to say about OW/YM relationships. What are your credentials? Or are you writing a book that is considered sheer entertainment?

Let us know. I think people will respond more willingly if they know more about what you're doing. I don't think ripping the term cougar apart holds much water. There most definitely ARE cougars out there, they have their own websites, and they are valid in their own right. To each his own, right? That's just not what Ageless is about. As SB said, we are not cougars here, no one considers themselves as such, so why keep trying? I get the sense that no one really understands your angle from the feedback you're getting here.

As an aside, I think saying "there must be some of you hot ladies out there" is a bit of a turn off. I consider myself intelligent, funny, attractive, etc. but your terminology is a bit stereotypical of a hootchie mama and certainly not a sophistocated woman, which is what many of we older women consider ourselves, and the reason intelligent, thoughtful, sensitive young men are attracted to us!!!

As an aside, I think saying "there must be some of you hot ladies out there" is a bit of a turn off. I consider myself intelligent, funny, attractive, etc. but your terminology is a bit stereotypical of a hootchie mama and certainly not a sophistocated woman, which is what many of we older women consider ourselves, and the reason intelligent, thoughtful, sensitive young men are attracted to us!!!

*skatergirl "high-fives" kat7*

every younger man i've dated asked me out first

Me too skater . . . or let me know he was waaaaaay interested in a relationship . . . but I have been accused of being a "cougar" since I have one tattooed on my shoulder. :(

Me too skater . . . or let me know he was waaaaaay interested in a relationship . . .

i believe it! i saw that episode you starred in on oprah...let's just say GORGEOUS!!! :)

honestly, the comment if it walks like a duck, its a duck, kinda freaked me out.

its like the poster is saying one thing and meaning another.

i may be brave today, but i have had my share of comments, accusations and just plain cruelty because of my relationship, if this book was nothing short of praising the older woman for finding love with a younger man, i would want NOTHING to do with it.

it took alot for many of us to get where we are today. i would not put my name anything near something that was not positive for these types of relationships.

since there can be no guarantee, then i for one, cannot participate.

There seems to be a mindset in those words, of a reported/writer who thinks they're open minded, and looks to bring a story just to the edge of the public's comfort zone without stepping on any toes, or helping in any way for that matter.

I'd like to see credentials, or the very least some honest research, but I'd be much more comortable with someone with a truly honestly open mind.

This is people's lives and families, and the worst thing you can do is distort and twist it.

I'm not saying you are or will, but you are heck of close to the line, if not on it, just by saying that.

I am simply talking to people, getting stories and telling them just like in any book (he's just not that into you, etc.) I am not trying to hurt anyone or mock anyone, that's not what this is about.

As far as the hot ladies comment, I'm joking. I technically can fall into the Cougar area myself and don't think it's the most glamorous role and my goal is to change that! OK?

I have many stories to date. I am protecting every one of my participants.

Tracy

BTW, I am a writer, and this is probably more of an entertainment book than anything else. And yes, there are Cougars, but then there is another category that I am trying to introduce.

Since I've been here I've gotten pissy about people who come online to do research. Some people don't mind, but I don't like it, nor do I think it's appropriate.

Ali

"He's Just Not That Into You" won a 2005 Quill Book award and was on the NY Times best seller list for weeks and weeks. It wasn't a collection of stories, it was a breezy, light but accurate account of how men think and was written by two well heeled authors who have been around for a long, long time. They both wrote for Sex and the City.

I thought the book "Older Women, Younger Men" was well written because there were lots of interviews not only with age gap couples, but interviews with social psychologists, psychotherapists, social workers, family members, etc. Not to say that it was a definitive book necessarily, but it was groundbreaking for it's time. I know it helped me a lot when I first entered my first serious age gap relationship.

The book entitled "Cougars" pretty much sums up the antithesis of what we're about here. If those kinds of women were here, this place wouldn't be the well of intelligent and connected humans that it mostly is...

If the intention of a book is to entertain, then is it fair to attempt to glean information from decent people attempting to have real and fulfilling relationships?
If you classify yourself "technically" as a cougar but want to have some kind of cathartic experience expunging your notion of yourself out of that role, isn't it better done in therapy rather than through the stories of others? Just a thought.

Since I've been here I've gotten pissy about people who come online to do research. Some people don't mind, but I don't like it, nor do I think it's appropriate.

Ali

Im tending to go with Leagues on this one.....

Times, I think you are going about this in 'entirely' the wrong way,......Plus, personally I find it rather sad to be trying to jump on the 'bandwagon' so to speak of 'other' books, using terms to 'hook' people in.....

Cant you be a bit more original???

"this is probably more of an entertainment book than anything else."


Though I am rather new here, it seems to me that most of the members who regularly post and participate are in or look to be in SERIOUS ag relationships. Not so sure about sharing the often heartfelt details of something so cherished for your "entertainment".

well i answered her questions and they were totally benign.....

Thanks Bugs. I have the right to tell my story and include anyone that wants to be included. It is done thoughtfully and many people enjoy reading about situations similar to their own.

Sorry guys, I'm sticking with this and it's going well. You may not agree, but you could wish me luck. It'll be sometime before it his the stores.

Tracy

I don't understand what's so problematic wuth the word "cougar".

As I understand from the net, a cougar relationship is a relation between an older woman and a younger man. Period.

Thus, it could be an entirely sexual relation, but it could also involve more than that. It could be that the woman takes advantage of a much younger man, or a young man taking financial advantage of and older woman, but it need not be anything like that.

So, I understand that the term "cougar" is quite neutral, neither good or bad in itself.

Why, then, do some posters jump on this word?


Regards,

Erland

I don't understand what's so problematic wuth the word "cougar".

As I understand from the net, a cougar relationship is a relation between an older woman and a younger man. Period.

Thus, it could be an entirely sexual relation, but it could also involve more than that. It could be that the woman takes advantage of a much younger man, or a young man taking financial advantage of and older woman, but it need not be anything like that.

So, I understand that the term "cougar" is quite neutral, neither good or bad in itself.

Why, then, do some posters jump on this word?


Regards,

Erland

Odd Even,

I don't have the complete answer, nor am I an authority...

but I'll give you my best guess.

In North America the term "cougar" refers to a predatory animal also known as a mountain lion. In our national parks in the west, the animal does prey on humans occasionally; typically it is not adult male humans who are at risk, but smaller, weaker types, ie, women and children.

So the term is not entirely benign in the way that other English slang terms are like "stud" or "chick" or "fox."

Personally, I suspect that this suggestion of a dangerous or stealthy predator is what upsets many women.

This is from the jacket cover of the book "Cougar." I think it's self explanatory.

Today's liberated lifestyle has made room for a whole new set of relationships — older women dating younger men.

She's confident, stylish, sophisticated and sexy, and she knows exactly what she wants — hot young men and lots of great sex! She's not interested in children or commitment. She's a cougar, and she's on the prowl.

Don't you know a satire when you read it? I would say to some degree that she exaggerated. The book is fun. Yes, there are Cougars, but I think it's a smaller population.

Don't you know a satire when you read it? I would say to some degree that she exaggerated. The book is fun. Yes, there are Cougars, but I think it's a smaller population.



Don’t you know rude when you write it?:eek:


I haven’t read the book in question and can’t comment on the content. It may well be “fun” and even entertaining. I believe though, that some AL members who are in serious ag relationships may find it less so; having had to personally deal with the very real struggles that can accompany such parings. The day–to-day reality of having to deal with such stereotypes, perceptions and the closed-mindedness of others can certainly cast a different light on what one may find humorous. Those that have fought to bring about an awareness of the validity of their own situations may not really appreciate a work that presumes to define such relationships in what can certainly be considered a negative light.

That’s what I’m talking about!:D

I think Valerie Gibson, who authored the book "Cougar" did intend it to be humorous, but a funny take on what she considered a fairly serious subject. She, after all, states she based her book on "years of research" and if she herself is any indication of a crappy track record, I'd say she takes the cake! She's been married FIVE times.

I don't think the Cougar method of finding a suitable mate is exactly working for her. :rolleyes:

Good point, Kat.

Shirl, I suggest you lighten up if you don't know the "book in question". It's not all bad.

Odd Even,

I don't have the complete answer, nor am I an authority...

but I'll give you my best guess.

In North America the term "cougar" refers to a predatory animal also known as a mountain lion. In our national parks in the west, the animal does prey on humans occasionally; typically it is not adult male humans who are at risk, but smaller, weaker types, ie, women and children.

So the term is not entirely benign in the way that other English slang terms are like "stud" or "chick" or "fox."

Personally, I suspect that this suggestion of a dangerous or stealthy predator is what upsets many women.


Harrisons mostly got it I think.... the main thing is that it seems to want to separate women that find themselves attracted to ym from women who are attracted to same age or older men, like there's a difference. A 25 year old woman who chats up a 25 year old man would not be a cougar, but there is NO difference in the actions. I've been 'chatted up' by women the same age, a couple of years younger, a couple of years older, and my now gf is 18 years older than me and is the one that made the move. Would she be considered a cougar whilst the others aren't? We've been together 2 years now and it's certainly not 'like that'. IMO it's a derogotary term. Btw, I was never very good at approaching women!!!

You know what, I would be all up for taking part in a book that portrays ow/ym relationships as entirely normal, but I'm not really interested in anything that tries to put yet more labels on them. They're just normal relationships between adults, no different at all... sometimes the women might use men for sex, sometimes the men might use women for sex... most are just men and women trying to find love as with the majority of relationships.

intime, i said this before.

ageless is a site that allows people who come here with agegap relationships to find a safe haven.

i have only joined one site in my entire life, it is this one.

my agegap relationship does not define who i am, but i have found very good advice and kind souls on this site.

i came here a mess.

maybe i sounded together but i was really shaky, i was shocked to hear people say, calm down, its ok, you are not so unusual.

i was far from a cougar.

in your book can you portray a woman like me? women who did not seek these relationships but found themselves in one? can you explain WHY these younger men find us so attractive to the point of beautiful?

can you explain the acceptance younger men give us, sorry to say this to the older guys, but the lack of preconcieved notions and baggage that sometimes comes with a same age and older partner?

i will give you an idea. have a chapter not from the womans perspective but from the younger man's, promote women.

we have had the short end of the stick regarding relationships for a long time, it was common and accepted for men to turn in the older wife for a newer model.

my sister is a very well known attorney and her husband also, they live in the best part of fort lauderdale on the water, most of my sisters friends were wives, in the last few years, nearly everyone of them is divorced and the new woman is a younger version of the old.

this has been societies accepted practice for years.

we need to promote that we are still worthwhile even when original partners have tossed us aside, that did happen to me.

i feel like its GOD's humor that i end up with a younger hunk, who has some weird fascination with how beautiful i am.

(he doesnt wear glasses)

i dont think many women expect kindness and love and passion, we are almost programmed to believe we passed those days by. i was very surprized i fell in love for the first time after 40.

i hope you understand the delicacy of the work that you are doing and you DO portray older women in a light that can be an inspiration to all women.

just my thoughts.

All I'm looking for is honesty. This is not a project that is meant to undermine any personal safety. Those that have participated thus far know that the questions are very general. I'm not looking to expose all of your inner most secrets. The project is one that is collecting data and trying to establish a trend or an understanding of the phenomena.

If you want to take part, there's no one who is more honest and it would be an honor.

P.S. I am trying to find a way to portray all of the women that do NOT consider the term Cougar part of their agenda. I was not a Cougar, I just found him, just happened.

Kat, I'd love to use you and P, but I know that you won't do it. I do feel your story would help a lot of women.

Trueheart, since older women are really not your thing, you may not know the term, cougar. But it is a negative one, for the most part, that means a woman is on the prowl to get a younger man (her prey) for sex only and/or to boost her ego.

Rob - - -

I think SB said it best in the first page of this thread. It is way more than just "chatting up." It means she "hunts" for younger men and is not particularly wanting to be in a relationship with them . . . she is hunting for them for her own pleasure and no real regard for what the younger man's feelings may be. The perception is that she takes young, eager, impressionable guys and uses them for her own sexual pleasure and then discards them to go on the prowl for more.

Men have been doing this very thing for centuries and society has never scrutinized those actions as harshly as they have the older women/younger man pairings.

Most of us here, I believe, are with our younger partners because we felt a strong "connection" with them, whereas the cougar is not about connecting. She's about conquering.

To be honest, when I first joined this site, I had never heard the term. And today, I do believe a lot of the media stories use the term loosely to describe ANY older woman/younger man relationship even if they are not trying to project the negative meaning of the term.

Intime... are you already a published writer? If so, would you direct us to your website.

We have had other writers here at Ageless and they let us know when their book was published, appearing at the bookstores, etc. :)

Maybe that would give you more credibility?

I have held off responding to this for a long time. I don't question you sincerity, but I think Kitty raises an excellent point and I think it bears strongly on why you aren't getting a better reception to this book from AL members. I think many of us came here because it was a safe haven where we could explore what we were terrified of; relationships with men young enough to be our sons! They made perfect sense to us because when we were with them our age gap disolved. The moment we were among the general public, we became an anomally. I have responded to the issue of why some of us maintain secret relationships, and as I get further and further into this relationship, I am slowly becoming bolder, but as I told you once in a pm, I have a general rule that I don't talk by phone with people I don't know. Fear is a terrible thing, but sometimes its a healthy defense mechanism.

The project is one that is collecting data and trying to establish a trend or an understanding of the phenomena.

This makes your book sound like it has a more scientific bent, and yet earlier you said it was merely entertainment. Collecting data and extrapolating conclusions is usually done by social scientists using statistics and a methodology that ensures neutral and objective data collection. If you have a degree in a related field, I think people would want to know that. If not, I would ask: is it a project, or is it entertainment? You've called it both. Perhaps your ambivalence as well as heretofore lack of credentials doesn't instill confidence with your potential candidates to interview.

Kat, I'd love to use you and P, but I know that you won't do it. I do feel your story would help a lot of women.

Thanks Intime, but I'm not sure even I would agree. My relationship with P had less to do with our age gap and more to do with mutual dysfunction than anything. I really believe that's true the farther down the road I get. I don't think our relationship was anything exemplary of much of anything other than two people who loved each other in their own screwy way.

MY story is quite entertaining.

I'm a published newspaper writer.

The project is one that is collecting data and trying to establish a trend or an understanding of the phenomena.


...why is it not a phenomenon when an older man dates a younger woman?

underscoring how it is so remarkable that older women date yonger men only helps keep women tied to the "double standard."

Exactly Skates.....

Why would we be wanting to draw attention to something that 'I' personally feel is 'unnecessary'.......

Putting 'any' type of energy back into that word 'cougar' whether good or bad, cannot be a good thing in 'my' mind.....I believe that this very word was invented by the vicious Media anyway.....

How can putting 'labels' on something ever have a chance to help anyone....

Look at your real 'reasons' for writing this book Times, and if it is of the 'financial' variety, then I feel you are at a loss.....How about writing a book on how to become more 'perceptive' in life, or something 'useful' like that....

This is the kind of book that 'hollywood' thrives on.......not very tasteful by the sounds of it.......BUT, I guess, I havent read it yet, so how can I judge the book.......somehow It just doesnt feel right though.......

Intime I know you have been on here for a while, and you are not some fly in looking to gain salacious stories etc.... you say you are a published writer....in newspapers......this makes you a journalist......and unfortunately for you most thinking people are wary of journalists ethics and what they can do with information.....I talk to media all the time, have done courses in how to do so, and have a communications degree.......its amazing how information can be distorted to respresent the opinion of the journalist at the cost of truth.

I think you would do well to share some of your questions, a bit more of the outline of your book, some links to your media writing and some background to your synopsis......like a writer would.....right now it seems you are still in journalist mode and skirting about something, while trying to get info....

I'm with the others, I wouldn't share with you till I knew full well what you were going to do with the information and I think it is unethical of you to say in one frame you are looking for entertainment value stories, and one the other trying to represent a more credible analysis of older women/younger man relationships. You can't have it both ways, come clean and people may trust you enough to disclose.

MY story is quite entertaining.

I'm a published newspaper writer.

Intime, I truly don't wish to offend, but just saying YOUR story is quite entertaining, in my eyes, brings sadness as to your lack of insight and continued denial.

I think much of your negative feedback here isn't even from those of us who read "if it's not love, what is it?" for over a year. But those of us who did know that your story was (and perhaps still is?) one of being involved with a drug addicted young man who was as on-again/off-again as only a drug addict can be, your enabling of his habit, and your own inability to cope with your struggle between him and your husband. Your writing then was random and chaotic and of a person who lacked a cohesive center.

People need to feel safe and that they are dealing with someone credible and grounded if they are to share their heartfelt stories. If your questions are superficial and lack depth, then there is no heart to the book.

I somehow feel that this attempt to write a book is aimed at either denying the dysfunction of your "entertaining" relationship by framing it as fun rather than facing the reality of it's ultimate sadness (because it IS very sad,) or is just outright denial. I get that you're hoping to make some bux down the road with it, which obviously would be nice, but your efforts would seemingly be better spent looking inward rather than outward for answers. Because that's where they are.

Either way, I wish you the best.

WOW, you guys are so smart..... skater!! sometimes you sound almost professor-ish, so profound and kat 7, you nailed it.

something isnt jelling and i cant put my finger on it except for choices of loose words here and there.

this whole ow/ym issue is TOTALLY double standard. thank you skater for bringing that up yet again.

well i answered her questions and they were totally benign.....

Same here...

I told Intime on the phone how I felt about the term 'cougar' (ie: I hate it) but her questions were really non-intrusive.

Thank you to everyone.

Make sure you follow up and maybe post samples of what you wrote

Honey, if and when this book is published, you will be the first to know. Keeping my fingers crossed.

Most of you lovely women I've interviewed are in serious relationships. I would love to hear from some of the secret ones, like mine.

Thanks again for all your support. This is going to be terrific!

I suppose, since I was a complete and total mess when I arrived at Ageless (okay no jokes!) AND totally in love with two ym, you would call me a Cougar, wouldn't you? People get themselves into all kinds of romantic fiascos, and this was one of mine. But I did love them, both in different ways.

Ali