Please someone tell me what's going on!

Ok, so today was class day.... everything was fine, normal nothing weird no awkwardness or anything after the kiss friday. He didn't seem to stare at me but it was a big class and we seriously worked our ***** off, so no big.

Then I get changed, freshen up like I usually do and go out there... to my surprise he's ALREADY changed and J is starting the car to warm it up! He practically dragged the other instructor out of there, and he barely looked at me the whole time!

Ok, so he's in a hurry... this is kind of unusual, but whatever, maybe he has somewhere to be... fine. BUT he didn't even say good bye! HE DID NOT SAY anything to me! THIS is unusual. I can't name a time in the last 6 months that he hasn't given me a HUG goodbye, let alone not even SAY goodbye! What is up with this??? I totally don't get it!

The only conclusions I can draw are that he regretted what happened and was trying to make that clear by snubbing me, he was SO nervous he couldn't face me directly, or that J had told him something (we kind of bonded, and we talk online or through texts occasionally) and I mentioned something good happened on fri, didn't mention what... but in a try 16 yr old spirit he wanted to know, and asked if i liked anyone to which i replied that anyone with my myspace knows i like someone, but i wouldn't say anything more than that... the only thing i can think of negative from this would be for him to mention this to my OM who then out of context thinks i like someone else! BUT the only reason i mentioned anything at all about fri to this kid was b/c my OM practically acts like a parent to him (this kid has a screwed up family) and so i thought if he said anything about it at all (which i don't know why he would) that he would say something good happened to me on fri or whatnot in which case it would be confirmed in OM's head that what happened was definitely a GOOD thing in my book... so unless it was some miscommunication i have no idea what would have caused him to act like that... i figured i'd throw that in there, in case it had any relevance... but i'm so depressed, i can't stop crying, it's ridiculous i feel like i was dumped or something, but it just hurts that he didn't even acknowledge me when he left... after all this time of hugs goodbye and cheek kisses.... does anyone have ANY clue to this??? anything to decifer this?!?! I'm so confused!!! I mean he didn't have to say what he said, he could have just kept up the pretense of "never doing that before" or whatnot, and he certainly didn't have to kiss me! a peck or not! Just one of those things might be meaningless... but both?!?! How could that be meaningless???

I plan to try to stop in early on tues to see if i can have a word alone with him (which is usually impossible) but the weather will be nice so i could ask him to step outside with me.... but I don't know what to do with myself til then, I feel so stupid.... I thought he liked me, and things seemed to being going forward and then this being snubbed?! He really has NEVER done that to me before....

Oh man, I really do empathize with your confusion. But you need to calm down. Really. You're going to make yourself crazy. So maybe he's freaking out a little. Let him. I still wouldn't make a big deal out of this. All that happened was that he probably wasn't sure how to handle things now so he decided to avoid any interaction for the time being. If that's the case then it's just nervousness. It's okay. You see him what, three times a week? You'll both get it sorted out.

The problem with reacting to him right now is that you're very emotional about this whole situation. And maybe his thoughts are going a mile a minute too. So if you misinterpret what he's doing (or even interpret it correctly but take it too negatively), then you're likely to overreact in some way. It's like over-correcting a car when you skid, you know? Something's wrong and you panic, and all of a sudden the car's in the ditch. Just try to stay calm and this will probably blow over.

G-E-L

PP-04's advice is always some of the best to be found.

He is attracted to you. I know this from a distance. Who knows what's going on inside his head. Now you have a grown man running from you like a school boy that's just been kissed. You must be hot-hot-hot.

Status quo for now sweetheart, be cool. Don't push the issue with him. Let him run away like a school boy. I don't like this non-verbal stuff, but that's the game he's playing. At some point you may want to pull away, be a little distant, a little less accessible. But not now, for now just let the situation between you and him sit as-is. Listen to PP-04.

You on the other hand, you need to take a mental vacation from all of this and focus on other stuff, or you're going to have an anxiety attack. Keep yourself busy & your mind occupied this weekend.

Big cyber hug sweetheart, kiss on cheek, pat on back.

luv ya, the old guy

Agree with both of the above... but I do also want to provide you a hug and comfort! It's gonna work itself out in the way that its meant to be... that much is sure...

My guts tell me you should lay low right now and let him think. He knows you like (love) him. There was nothing confusing when you pulled him closer for a kiss. He knows you want to know him more and you are available. Right now he may be shy, concerned for his relationship with his students, your dad and you. Right now lay low. Be friendly but do not go out of your way. If he wants more he will let you know. I am sure that is frustrating for you. It is flatering to have a younger woman show an interest in someone older. If its meant to be it will happen.


Mark

I am pretty sure his head is running a million miles an hour.

From what I have read on AL, the OM need a bit more time to get used to the idea of a relationship with a YW. I know it drives us a bit nutty in the mean time, but all we can do is wait. Feel free to PM me.

Well he was the one to kiss me 1st, I just pulled him back for another... thus the basis for confusion.

I was going to try to talk to him, but maybe I shouldn't... in the spirit of laying low... but I wanted to write a message and just give that to him... simply putting:

"Take A Chance" and not saying anymore....

does that sound too corny or pushy? I don't want him to rethink this... I don't want him to be so nervous, but I want to say something to him to encourage him, let him know it's ok to be nervous but you don't have to run away from it!
I was also considering writing something along the lines of :

"When you're ready to take a chance, you know what to do."

Any thoughts or opinions if I should or shouldn't write him a brief message, or what I should/shouldn't say?

The only reason I don't want to lie low is b/c I don't want him to be discouraged... I want him to know I'm ready to go forward and I want to be able to encourage him and let him know I'm not just going to give up that easily. I feel if I laid low or pulled back then he might see that as I'm not serious and I would back down quickly from adversity...

You really really need to chill out. This man already knows you are interested. Give him some credit for being able to figure that out on his own...he doesn't need constant reminders from you. Let him sort through what he already has from you on his own. Relax, step back and he will come to you and then he can feel good about that....that it was him that made the next move.

I never thought about it like that lyn... that's an interesting point.

I think later when/if you make the next move, it should not be open ended. It should ask a simple question and await a simple answer. Your next move should put you in a position of strength, not weakness....

That is, saying, "Take a chance" leaves things exactly where they are.

I say don't make a move until you are ready for an answer one way or another... and the question should be one where he is forced to commit one way or another.

Think of it like martial arts. Use the strength and momentum of the other person along with your own to get the desired result. Leaving yourself open and weak will only hurt you and won't get you where you'd like to be. This means waiting for an opportune moment where you both seem to be in synch and asking a strong question or waiting until you are to the point where you are so frustrated that you are strong and can't take it any more and would just rather know one way or another.

"I was also considering writing something along the lines of :

"When you're ready to take a chance, you know what to do.""

Not for nothin' Lily, but if he knew what to do next, he would have already done it. He really likes you dear, and he knows you like him. That's not the problem. Good bet is he's wrestling with the age thing as well as the teacher thing. For right now, be accessible to him, but not forward. And above all, just be kind. That alone will bring him closer to you. Courage dear. We're all behind you.

Mike

My take on this would be that he is confused too and needs some time to sort out the realization that you really ARE interested in him and not just another flirting student. This can be a mind blowing realization (it was for me when I found out my OM was actually interested in me romantically, especially since I had not let myself indulge in feelings for him thinking he could not possible be interested in me).

So don't change anything--don't pull back and don't push for an explanation now either. Give him time enough to figure out what he wants to do with this turn of events (i.e., Friday's kiss, etc.). As several others have said, he knows you are interested in him but now he may need to figure out any other complications before he makes HIS move. I think he truly likes and is attracted to you. But he has a lot to work through (wrapping his mind around an age gap relationship, student/teacher roles, etc.).

And for your part and your own peace of mind, please quit trying to guess his thoughts and motives. You seem to be wrapping yourself up into mental knots over this. Something my OM says is that whatever will happen will be something you did not expect. Or in other words, no matter how many scenarios you come up with in your head there will always be something more you haven't considered. So just relax and whatever will happen is what will happen.

You all have such valid points, thank you for helping me get through this.... it's just so frustrating taking one step forward and 2 steps back! I hope you all are right in your assments of his feelings... and I do hope he comes to the realization that my feelings for him are true and not just some fleeting crush on a "teacher"... I will play it cool, and keep the status quo, I'll keep flirting and being silly, and just being myself towards him.... if he pulls away I'll let him but I'm not going to change what I've been doing and how I've been acting... but I won't push either. I hope he will be true to himself and let himself feel whatever he does, despite what others would say, I want to give him more credit than that b/c of the person I know he is.... But i really do appreciate all of your opinions, you guys have really become a second family to me through all of these ups and downs the last few months!

You all have such valid points, thank you for helping me get through this.... it's just so frustrating taking one step forward and 2 steps back! I hope you all are right in your assments of his feelings... and I do hope he comes to the realization that my feelings for him are true and not just some fleeting crush on a "teacher"... I will play it cool, and keep the status quo, I'll keep flirting and being silly, and just being myself towards him.... if he pulls away I'll let him but I'm not going to change what I've been doing and how I've been acting... but I won't push either. I hope he will be true to himself and let himself feel whatever he does, despite what others would say, I want to give him more credit than that b/c of the person I know he is.... But i really do appreciate all of your opinions, you guys have really become a second family to me through all of these ups and downs the last few months!

You have received such excellent advice so there's nothing more I could possibly add. It is really great to get male perspective on this issue. Take heart GEL; time will tell!:)

CHILL WOMAN!! :yes:

It's called ebb and flow. rememeber that everytime he ebbs, there will be a lovely flow, but you have to learn to wait for it instead of being a needy child. Get busy with your life!
This is a very tough lesson to learn because at this point, it is NOT about him, it is about your own insecurities. He is the icing, darling...he is NOT the cake. YOU ARE THE CAKE, so CHILL and do nothing and when he comes back (whenever he does), ask no questions, but receive that attention and enjoy! Be welcoming, warm and very:yes: very gracious!

Do not call, text, email, instafart, chat or whatever!!

Yeah... so... everything was "normal" in class... seriously, he's a pretty freakin good actor! But I left as soon as class was done b/c some of the ppl wanted to go out and i had to run home and get my wallet... well i drove back that way within 10 mins, and his truck was already gone and another instructor was locking up... hmmm.... seems he can't get out of there fast enough lately... ugh it's so tough, he isn't as "flirty" as he was, but again, class was a larger tonight too, and I did notice him looking at me and keeping SOME eye contact... but things are different now, and it's really depressing me! I want to say something, but I'm remember what everyone was saying about just giving it time and still being available to him when he's ready to come around! *sigh* :banghead:

ugh it's so tough, he isn't as "flirty" as he was, but again, class was a larger tonight too, and I did notice him looking at me and keeping SOME eye contact... but things are different now, and it's really depressing me!

Hon, honestly, do you have a hobby, or something, ANYTHING, to take your mind off of this for the moment?

You're doing what we ALL do at one point or another. Getting WAY too into thinking about it. He's keeping eye contact, but not as much. Why? WHY? WHY??????

The more you keep thinking like this, the worse it will be for you in the long run. You're going at 725 mph, and you'd be best off putting on the brakes right now. That's why I suggested finding a hobby, or something else just to keep your mind off of it, even for an hour or two a day. Give yourself a break, hon.

Martial arts IS my hobby....

But it's really bugging me that everyone keeps telling me to do other things and that I need to "relax" or "chill out" I'm not in some hysterical fit that I need to be told to "breathe" and whatnot, I'm just frustrated and thought it was OK to come here and vent my feelings and concerns without being judged b/c I happen to think about it too much or whatnot.

I'm just frustrated and thought it was OK to come here and vent my feelings and concerns without being judged b/c I happen to think about it too much or whatnot.

I don't think that it's a question of "judging" at all.

I was just giving my impression of it. But, you know, do what you need to do. If looking at every little thing and wondering about it is making you feel good or better, then by all means, have at it.

I personally think that it's completely counterproductive, but do what you need to do.

As I'm not one to nod my head and deal with the "OMG, he sorta looked at me tonight, what do I do?" thing, I'll just end this by wishing you the best.

I'm sorry mishigas, it's not just you, I've just been feeling a little "attacked" lately, I never said it made me feel better to over analyze everything, but it's not like I can wave a magic wand and change my thoughts... it really doesn't matter what I'm doing, my mind is always going a mile a minute, no matter who or what else it's on.

it really doesn't matter what I'm doing, my mind is always going a mile a minute, no matter who or what else it's on.

No apologies necessary. We've all been through this.

What I was trying to get through to you though is that you NEED to find something to take your mind off of it, for at least a little while. If you don't give your brain a bit of a break, you're not doing yourself any good.

So, with that being said, I hope you find it. SOMETHING. Because, if you don't, you're going to shoot yourself in the foot with this. I guarantee that he's seeing or feeling what I am now. This....desperation? no, that's not quite right....this...."ok, this has to be done NOW, what are we doing? etc, etc" feeling? Yeah, that's it.

He's feeling this. And, that's why I, and the others here, have given you the words that we have. I can't speak for anyone but myself with that, but I do know that my words come from experience. What you have said here about your experience in class, he is feeling. I guarantee it.

Take a step back. It doesn't matter what you do in order to get there, but DO IT.

You know that you have people here that will listen, and of course, I'm one of those. But, you've got to, at least, REMOTELY hear what we are saying.

You've got a good thing going here. Deep breath, and whatever else you have to do to let him make the next move. Guys like that, you know. ;)

Hon, I DO wish you the best, and I DO understand where you're coming from. Feel free to vent, but also try to do something productive with this. It would be a shame to let it slip away.

I know I am not one to talk since I can't come right out and say things to my OM, but am going to suggest the opposite to everyone here.

Since the kisses have already happened, it's already out in the open.

This is only one suggestion and you may or may not be comfortable with it.

I know it has been difficult to get some alone time with him, but if you can somehow wing it, you could say that you want to talk about what happened the other night.

You could mention how you felt a connection with him over the last few months and you thought he felt the same, but ever since the other night you have noticed that he has been distancing himself from you.

You could ask him if you had misinterpreted his feelings. He will have no choice to respond as I doubt he would just walk out on you and leave you hanging.

I think it is only fair that he give you some sort of answer after all that has happened, even if it means him telling you that he needs time to think about things.

Which ever approach you choose to take, you'll have my full support.

I know I am not one to talk since I can't come right out and say things to my OM, but am going to suggest the opposite to everyone here.

Since the kisses have already happened, it's already out in the open.

This is only one suggestion and you may or may not be comfortable with it.

I know it has been difficult to get some alone time with him, but if you can somehow wing it, you could say that you want to talk about what happened the other night.

You could mention how you felt a connection with him over the last few months and you thought he felt the same, but ever since the other night you have noticed that he has been distancing himself from you.

You could ask him if you had misinterpreted his feelings. He will have no choice to respond as I doubt he would just walk out on you and leave you hanging.

I think it is only fair that he give you some sort of answer after all that has happened, even if it means him telling you that he needs time to think about things.

Which ever approach you choose to take, you'll have my full support.

I agree with this too.

"I never said it made me feel better to over analyze everything, but it's not like I can wave a magic wand and change my thoughts... it really doesn't matter what I'm doing, my mind is always going a mile a minute, no matter who or what else it's on."

Hi Lily,
Probably the best thing you can do is just what you're currently doing, and that's writing your thoughts and feeling down. The trouble we all have with thoughts is, your mind works like a computer in that is tends to store stuff is parts, a chunk here and a chunk there. That's why, when you're unable to sleep at night because you can't get your OM out of your head, the thoughts seem to be broken up. You know; 4 seconds of him kissing you, them 6 seconds of a conversation you had with him 2 months ago, and then 10 seconds of a scenario that never happened but always seemed like it should. Sometimes the best way to deal with this is to write your thoughts down. You can write 'em here certainly, or you could get a notebook and write yourself letters (what I did when I was going through my divorce). The writing forces your brain to put thoughts in some kind of working order and will help more effectively move them along out of your head.
Your heart needs a rest dear. Remember RebeccaSue's advice. It's all ebb and flow. Ebb stinks but you can deal with it. He likes you dear. When the flow comes, get a life jacket. You may need it.

Waiting for the best with you,
Mike

could he use some persuasion sweetheart?

http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h51/gp_fillmore/persuasion.jpg

Ugh I hate the difference in opinion where both sides have such valid arguments!!! I'm already confused lol and I don't know what to do now b/c I can look at it objectively and I still don't see a definitive way to go... I trust the ones who've been in this situation before, but then again if one person's opinion can vary so much from another.. it just shows that different people respond differently to these kinds of situations... I know what I want, and I know what I want to do about it... but as some have said if he's pulling back I should respect that, but if he's just uncertain, I want to give him confidence in what could be "us" you know?
Obviously it's out there already since it happened... but I also get maybe he wants to be the one to make the next move... although him kissing me was kind of a move... so he kissed the corner of my mouth, then he asked me to join him and the other 2 people for dinner (and treated) then i asked him to lunch (which still hasn't been rescheduled), then he "tricked" me into showing up when there was no class that day, so then i ask the "question," then he gave the response he did and i followed with some possibly encouraging further questions, he kissed me, i kissed him back... so... does that count as my move or his move? he initiated the 1st kiss... so that would make it my turn wouldn't it?! LOL this is actually making me laugh typing this, but I'm just trying to work through it! Ugh confusing! And I haven't been thinking about it "as" much... it's kind of on the back burner, where it's there, but it's not demanding every moment of my thoughts like it was... I think it was just the disappointment and shock of his abrupt exits.... I mean I didn't expect that he would be freaked out like that... but I have been getting this feeling that he's going to come around... like this "gut" feeling that he's apprehensive, but that he's going to come around.... hmmm maybe...

Ha ha mike you're totally right. That is how my mind works... i see like bits of moments where we laughed at something or he grabbed my hand or hugged me or whatnot... does mix in with the fantasy too sometimes! but i do write stuff... not as much as i was doing when i initially started falling for him... i'd write fantasy stories and journal all the little things... but this isn't like those little things LOL. Ha life jacket! Oh baby if it could only flow like that I think i'd be a very happy gal, b/c our personalities while we have some differences, we have a lot of quirks that seem like they would fit just right together and i'm sure i'd have a lovely time with him! Thanks for your well wishes, I really wish the same for you! It's wonderful to have that feeling of desire towards that person and to know deep inside they feel it too... it's just that waiting game that stinks!

George, I think he MIGHT need some persuasion but how would you go about this? He doesn't do internet and I don't have his number... so unless you have some surefire advice I could use from an OMs point of view of what I could say or do I don't know how plausible this persuasion would be... although i appreciate the thought! *hugs*

I was thinkin' we'd send a couple of the boys over to rough him up...


I was just jokin' sweetheart, trying to make you laugh

haha you always make me laugh and/or smile, george!
And you could TRY to rough him up, but I suspect he'd win since he's got mad skills! Did I forget to mention he's practically a 3rd degree blackbelt? ;) That's just another thing that's hugely sexy about him! :yes: hehe

Ugh I hate the difference in opinion where both sides have such valid arguments!!! I'm already confused lol and I don't know what to do now b/c I can look at it objectively and I still don't see a definitive way to go...

I know it is confusing now but I am sure you will do what feels right to you when the opportunity comes. Thinking of ya! :bighug:

Thanks esjayo, I'm sorry I haven't gotten back to you yet through PM, I'll send you my conatact info out of AL.

As for an update, things in class ARE different now. He doesn't look at me the same, or acknowledge me the same way he was before. It really hurts, b/c I thought it was going somewhere, and I almost am questioning if that kiss was worth feeling like this now everytime I see him.... he barely looks at me, he's very short and not chatty anymore, and I just don't know what to make of it... again he flew out of there.

My dad found this ring the other day that is a family heirloom and I haven't taken it off except to participate in class which when I came out after changing I went to show the kid (he's recently out of the closet, but he has always had a fancy for girly things and jewelry) and when my OM saw it he thought I was engaged! I was like NO i'm wearing it on my right hand, you wear it on your left if you're married or engaged. That was probably the most conversation I got out of him.

So I can't stand it anymore, I'm going to write him an email... just a quick breaking the ice kind of thing, since he won't stay around long enough to even ASK him for 5 mins to talk. In which I plan to say something like "I can't believe you thought I was engaged! I can't even get the guy I like to go out with me, how do you expect me to get one to marry me?" Something like that, prob very short b/c he doesn't do the whole email thing... well, he says he doesn't know how to send them! I don't know... I'm probably going to work on some sort of hand written letter in the next few days to sum up my feelings and articulate them in a non threatening or overtly emotional way. I just can't stand this coldness that's formed, and it's really hurting me, and it's not fair that I should just sit back and WAIT for him to be ready to talk or something. I can't do that to myself. So that's all I've got... I need a long hot shower and order some chinese food to take the edge off tonight. *sigh* :paperbag:

What? You're going to contact him and put yourself DOWN in the process for the sake of being "cute"??

It goes like this, "Hi, It's me. Wanted to check in and see how you are. Give me a call when you can."

That's it. And if he doesn't call, it's OVER.

Come on, woman!

Put myself down? LOL I wouldn't be putting myself down... it's called a joke, and that's funny to me!

Anyways... this is what I wrote and it's getting sent in the next 2 mins whether or not anyone else agrees...

"I can't believe you thought I was engaged! I can't even get the guy I like to call me or go out with me, and you expect I'm going to get one to marry me?!? haha now that's funny.

Speaking of that guy, maybe you could tell me what to do now since I feel like he's been avoiding me...? I just wish I knew whether he's still "nervous" or if he's regretting what happened... (which, for the record, I don't regret it at all; it was actually something I'd wanted for awhile). I hope he comes around and sees what's in front of him... what do you think?... (from a guy's perspective) do you think he'd take a chance like that?

~(name)

"One should not let fear govern their happiness"

I got no words of wisdom, I think the OM is being really rude and selfish and I'm so sorry you're going through this...

Just wanted to add, lol - when you're engaged you wear the ring on your right hand. Sorry I'm a dork but that just stood out to me in your post.

Thanks. Yeah I told him that! LOL

Well it's sent, what's done is done. So we'll see if this goes anywhere from here. In case it didn't make sense the whole "asking his advice" was b/c when I opened up the conversation it was a "hypothetical" question regarding him... (I don't know if I mentioned that in this thread or not, b/c it's in the other one) But it seemed easiest and nonconfrontational that way.

Just wanted to add, lol - when you're engaged you wear the ring on your right hand. Sorry I'm a dork but that just stood out to me in your post.

I've never seen anybody wearing it on the right hand. It's not customary here in Canada, anyhow.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Engagement_ring

I believe in spain they wear their wedding rings on the the right hand... but yeah that's just common knowledge, so I'm not sure why he would say that unless he truly just got spooked at the thought of me possibly being engaged (whether or not it was misunderstood about what hand) *shrugs* It's a beautiful ring and I'm proud to wear it b/c if has sentimental value and family ties and plus it's totally my style too! LOL

Martial arts IS my hobby....

But it's really bugging me that everyone keeps telling me to do other things and that I need to "relax" or "chill out" I'm not in some hysterical fit that I need to be told to "breathe" and whatnot, I'm just frustrated and thought it was OK to come here and vent my feelings and concerns without being judged b/c I happen to think about it too much or whatnot.

I have some questions: did you sleep with this man? The situation you described in your first post on this thread is classic *sleep with him too soon* behaviors on both your parts. He pulls back and the woman is left feeling like she's been dumped. Sometimes, this is the outcome of that behavior! When men have sex with women too soon, they can sometimes confuse that feeling with love. But when they wake up in the morning, they know it is a new love interest in their lives, and not a woman they've been with for a long time. Okay, so men are total dopes and this SCARES THE PEE OUT of them! Often, they run the other way.

Just my take on your first post.

Ali

NO lol I didn't sleep with him! We shared a a couple of kisses (if you could call it that) that night 2 weeks ago and that was it! I haven't even been able to get him alone one on one to talk out of the dojo, that time he was alone was an extreme rarity, b/c like I mentioned to begin with he always takes that kid home (he ususally picks him up after work and brings him there...) so yeah never alone. If i had slept with him I would have posted that! Everything that has occured good or bad, big or small (relatively speaking) I've put out here. So I don't know why someone would act so freaked over a kiss...? I get what you're saying... and that's a classic case there. But nothing even mildly intimate has happened outside of my imagination!

Lily, I don't think you're likely to get a response to your E-mail. He likes you dear, and he likes you a lot. The problem, as I've said before, is the age gap thing and the teacher-student thing. Men don't talk about this kind of stuff as women do, but if he did, I think you'd find that he thinks he has done something wrong. In a matter of two kisses, a really platonic relationship with one of his students suddenly turned into something else. Like it or not, he wasn't ready for what happened and it scared him.
I think you need to talk to him, face-to-face. It needs to be a simple, honest conversation between adults, and if the only way you can get that from him is to stand in front of his vehicle after class, then do it. The two of you need to reach an understanding as to just where you are. I will tell you right now that he's not where you would like him to be, but I think that by talking to him, and as soon as possible, you've got a better chance of keeping what you already have. You will also then have the potential of moving the relationship forward, which is more than you have right now. Talk to him,...and soon.

I'm in your corner,
Mike

I just have one question then... If he does in fact like me (which I'm starting to doubt now) why is he acting like this? I mean why act so cold to me and barely look at me or say 2 word to me out of class? I get that maybe he's not ready or what not, but why this weird behavior? Why not just act like he did before? I don't get it. If you're not ready to move forward what's wrong with keeping the status quo then?

As for what you mentioned about going from platonic to more than that, if he wasn't ready, why did he do it? I wouldn't have characterized what we had before as platonic... I've felt it's been slightly more than that for awhile... I don't think the way we flirted was platonic, but that's my own interpretation of it.

As for the teacher student thing, I don't see why that has to be an issue, it's not a "class room" environment, he's not like my manager, it's not his real job, and the atmosphere there is quite casual. Plus it IS possible to keep those things discrete and it's not like there haven't been others who there who met and dated/and or even got married as a result of getting to know eachother there. I get that he takes his martial arts seriously, whether it's instructing or training, and I don't want to deter him from that (or myself b/c it's my passion too).

I know he probably won't respond to the email, but I felt that I needed to send it anyway, I don't even know for sure if he'll read it in the next couple days or weeks. And the only problem standing in front of his vehicle, again, is the kid he drives is ALWAYS there, in fact he only goes on the same day. I was thinking my best bet might be going in tuesday and just asking him to come outside or something (hopefully it won't be cold, or we could sit in my car). I try to do things and say things as to not give other people a reason to be suspicious of our behavior towards eachother.... I'm really trying to be considerate about keeping a low profile....

I just have one question then... If he does in fact like me (which I'm starting to doubt now) why is he acting like this?

...because he thinks there's something wrong with all of this and he's feeling guilty.

Wrong in whose eyes? His? Mine? His friends' ? Society's?

His Lily, and probably society's also as he sees it. I think you'll find that he hasn't spoken of those kisses to anyone. At this point he's trying to sort this out in his own head, and is having a lot of trouble with it because some preconceived ideas of what's right and wrong are bumping up against his very recent feelings for you. My bet is he's still trying to sort it all out. That's why I suggest talking to him. He needs to get out of his own head. You know how you've been trying to sort it all out. And you have us! He's trying to do this on his own, and probably not doing very well at it. Talk to him. Speech remains the clearest form of communication, and right now you both need answers.

Thanks Mike, I REALLY REALLY appreciate all your input! I don't want him to feel bad about it! Things were so nice and then that was like WHOA wow! And i was so excited, I wish he COULD get out of his own head and just enjoy things for what they are, and that we could just enjoy eachother for who we are. I hate that society has to dictate what's right when it comes to things like this! What's right is finding someone who likes you and cares about you as a person, that's what's right! I will talk to him... I'm afraid to, and it's going to be hard but I do need answers. He might think that pursuing me is wrong, but what's wrong is ignoring this situation... this is how people get hurt... and as far as age... that's not the mature thing to be doing!

Thanks Mike, I REALLY REALLY appreciate all your input! I don't want him to feel bad about it! Things were so nice and then that was like WHOA wow! And i was so excited, I wish he COULD get out of his own head and just enjoy things for what they are, and that we could just enjoy each other for who we are. I hate that society has to dictate what's right when it comes to things like this! What's right is finding someone who likes you and cares about you as a person, that's what's right! I will talk to him... I'm afraid to, and it's going to be hard but I do need answers. He might think that pursuing me is wrong, but what's wrong is ignoring this situation... this is how people get hurt... and as far as age... that's not the mature thing to be doing!

I don't think he's ignoring you Lily. Truth told, I suspect he knows exactly where you are every minute you're in the dojo. You need answers; so does he. Talk. Just talk and also listen to what he has to say. I can't tell you he'll be completely honest with you (at this point, it's likely he's not being very honest with himself). He may even try to push you away. If he does, then go. Put some distance between you and accept that whatever may happen isn't going to happen now. Be whatever you can be and be patient.
Talk to him, face to face, and see what happens next.

His Lily, and probably society's also as he sees it. I think you'll find that he hasn't spoken of those kisses to anyone. At this point he's trying to sort this out in his own head, and is having a lot of trouble with it because some preconceived ideas of what's right and wrong are bumping up against his very recent feelings for you. My bet is he's still trying to sort it all out. That's why I suggest talking to him. He needs to get out of his own head. You know how you've been trying to sort it all out. And you have us! He's trying to do this on his own, and probably not doing very well at it. Talk to him. Speech remains the clearest form of communication, and right now you both need answers.

Of course, none of us here know this instructor, but based on what you have posted I have to agree with Mike's sentiments here. I was in a similar situation as you, but on the other side. Similar in that it was OM/YW although we met and worked together at work while you are in a class setting. When I say "the other side" it is because he was the one who realized the attraction between us first and also made the first moves, while I was sort of dense (not thinking he could be attracted to me) and didn't pick up on a lot. Once it finally hit me what was going on between us (the equivalent of that night of the kisses for you) I had all these things running through my head that were so overwhelming that I needed the space to sort through them.

My OM gave me some time but we were still working together and it was awkward. I wanted to talk to him about how I felt, but was unsure how to start the conversation and was nervous about how he might react. I didn't sit as close to him as I had before, I didn't hang around at the end of the work day and left right away, and I kept all conversation between us just on what was necessary for work. Eventually he brought the topic up, not in a way to force me to decide whether to pursue a relationship with him or not, but from the basis of "something has changed between us...I'm sorry if I've said or done anything to upset you and if I did it wasn't intentional...I'm not sure what you are thinking or feeling, but I want you to be comfortable and for us not to lose the friendship that we have, etc". This opened the door for us to talk and set me at ease knowing that he wasn't going to pressure me and we also talked about how we would interact at work until I was able to sort everything out. Until then he had no idea what was going on with me (whether I was confused, offended, scared, angry, or what!)

I know this has been long-winded, but I guess what I'm trying to say is I think you should go ahead and try to talk to him. Just don't demand, or even expect, a decision on his part. Try to make sure he knows you want to keep the friendship and although you would like more you also want him to be comfortable. See how he responds. If he is not interested romantically, then the two of you need to talk specifics about how to proceed from here so you are both comfortable continuing the friendship and neither one is getting frustrated, feeling pressured, or getting mixed signals.

If you can't find a long enough time to talk to him, try saying something like "Could we sit down and talk sometime. I feel like I've done something to offend you (or whatever else you want to say briefly here) and I would like for us both to be comfortable around each other like we used to be."

Thanks Amy, that has helped a lot hearing your story being more from his side of things. I don't want to pressure him or make him uncomfortable, it's just that I'm confused and frustrated and I don't exactly have much patience to begin with so this is torture to me!

How much time do you think I should wait to talk to him? I mean it's been 2 weeks since... but I've only seen him 3 times for class... Should I wait longer (even tho I sent that email, which like I said, I don't know when or if he'll read it)?

It has probably been long enough. I think in my case it was a week, but since we were working together it was the 5th day of things being awkward. So you've already had 3 instances to confirm that it wasn't just a one-time thing where he was busy or preoccupied, I think the 4th or 5th time would be long enough that you could go ahead and try to talk to him if you can.

Between now and then, I would suggest you try as hard as possible to get in the mind frame of keeping/repairing the friendship. That your goal for this talk would be to find out what is going on with him and at the very least set him at ease and get to two of you back to the level you were before the kisses. If you can do this I think it will help when you talk to him to remove any sense of pressure for more. And hopefully will also help you to relax so that no matter what his answer you are okay. If he just wants friendship, you are already prepared for that. And if he wants more, even better!

In college my old classmate, we used to call her "air jordan" met up with my landlord at a gym. The alums get to go if they donate, and it's really a great thing in some ways. But this didn't turn out quite as well, maybe unless you call it an experience, because when they met, they did get involved emotionally, but it was derailed because they were both uncomfortable with what society expected of them, and decided not to date any longer! Maybe there was more, actually, there always is, but I have to ask you: Do you want to go further with this knowing this man is so uncomfortable with age gap? People on both sides of this board, yw/om or ow/ym have had the awful experience of a partner that is so uncomfortable with societies expectations (and their own) of dating that it's caused problems and sometimes derailed the romance. Think about where you put your heart before you go there!

Ali

In college my old classmate, we used to call her "air jordan" met up with my landlord at a gym. The alums get to go if they donate, and it's really a great thing in some ways. But this didn't turn out quite as well, maybe unless you call it an experience, because when they met, they did get involved emotionally, but it was derailed because they were both uncomfortable with what society expected of them, and decided not to date any longer! Maybe there was more, actually, there always is, but I have to ask you: Do you want to go further with this knowing this man is so uncomfortable with age gap? People on both sides of this board, yw/om or ow/ym have had the awful experience of a partner that is so uncomfortable with societies expectations (and their own) of dating that it's caused problems and sometimes derailed the romance. Think about where you put your heart before you go there!

Ali's not wrong. Of course right now you don't know what your OM is uncomfortable with. Maybe it's the age gap. Maybe it's some version of the teacher-student thing. Maybe it's gas from something he ate. I wouldn't bet on the last one, but at this point you really don't know. Ali's also got some valid points regarding derailed relationships here at Ageless. Of course derailed relationships aren't limited to those with an age gap, and, as we have seen, there have been some solid successes on this site also. Ali ended her post by saying, "Think about where you put your heart before you go there." I would suggest that, when it comes to loving relationships, they're way too important to spend a lot of time thinking about them.
In the end,Lily, the question is, what is he worth to you? If he's worth everything, then be prepared to risk everything and go talk to the man. If not, then don't. The choice is your's dear, and we're with you whichever way you turn.

Mike

I can't say with all certainty that he is worth EVERYTHING to me... there's so much more I need to uncover and more time I need to spend with him to determine that, but he is worth a great deal to me, that I am certain.

My response to a partner being uncomfortable... is that you don't know unless you try! And what could it hurt to spend some time together and figure it out?! If we "clicked" in a more romantic way, then we clicked and we'd have to discuss the pros and cons and what we were both comfortable with in respect to developing a serious relationship and whether or not to bring it out in the open or to remain discrete.

But it seems that this it a bit rash so far, sense I'm just trying to figure out what he's thinking/feeling about this, and to find out what he wants. If he didn't want to pursue something further than I'd have to respect that, I wouldn't force him to be with me. But if he did want to try to start something more, than I would certainly talk to him and see where we stand and what we both want. I'm not so selfish that I would try to pressure him... however, I think it's only fair to talk to him and find out WHAT he's thinking and what he wants to do about things whether it's to progress further or remain just friends... what's unfair is being left in the dark.

G.E.L.

It was nice to hear Amy's story, since she has been on the other side of this situation before. I think the way her OM handled it was really wonderful. You may want to consider saying something similar to your OM, but of course in your own style.

I think if you don't say something you are going to spontaneously combust :eek:, so I would just go for it. At least you will have some answers and hopefully give yourself some peace.

KK

Lily,

Just wanted to clarify...

When I was talking about him getting comfortable again, I was referring to resolving whatever is causing this current awkwardness between the two of you (not necessarily being comfortable/uncomfortable with a relationship, the age gap, or student/teacher thing).

Amy

Just wanted to report that he didn't act AS weird last night as he has been... still didn't really talk to me outside of class, but he was looking at me A LITTLE bit more than the last couple weeks... and he's even hugged me the last 2 times i saw him.... (which could have been more my lead than his, but it might have just gone back to the "norm" of exchanging a hug when parting) maybe things are looking up...? I still think I need to talk to him about it, even if it's just a quick reference to it but I think he needs to know I'm still on board and I need to know where he stands on this! But that's all I've got to post about today! :cool:

Ok, I should make it known that they're not "friends" like friends, just when he was in karate, everyone is kind of close knit there, they didn't speak out of that context except when they were both at my dinner a few weeks back. So that's not an issue... I just meant at the time my dad was going and my OM could have felt weird about it seeing my dad in class... but my dad quit a couple months ago, so that's that. Granted he prob would still worry about what my dad would think, like you said, and I worry about that too... but my dad and I are pretty close and I don't think it would be that big of a deal... maybe a little awkward but I don't think he'd like disown me or anything crazy like some other parents, he's pretty supportive about things, and I think he would just want me to be happy with someone who is going to treat me right and who is a stand up guy.

I'm glad you mentioned a time frame and some personal notes on the waiting.... thinking, figuring it out stuff... I think I'll ask him on fri if he is free sometime this weekend to chat or maybe during the week... thanks for your input wesley! i will defnitely think about what you've said.

Why not invite him to go have a coffee after class on Friday? See how he reacts to that. Friends go have drinks or coffee all the time. Maybe you could do something simple like that to start with.

Ok, 1st of all, can't do anything after class b/c he ALWAYS drives that kid home like I've already mentioned.

My mom is dead, and although I think I have a good relationship with my dad, I'm not confident that it's THAT good to go to him about this, let alone have him talk to my OM. There is a big difference in your situation with the YW who was only 7 years younger than you, and I agree it was a good thing to do and showed respect to her parents. However, my OM is approximately the same age as my dad (29 yrs older than me) and I think that for them to have some kind of guy talk about him dating me, and whatnot, would just be strange. I'm an adult, and so is he, so I do not think he needs my father's approval to date me... that's just kind of weird at this point in my life.

Hey there Greeneyedlily

At this point, I think something needs to happen. There is far too much guessing and analyzing going on. Ive been there and it starts to get a little obsessive. You build up all this "stuff" that may or may not be reality.

I think, at least from my safe little perspective here :o that you are an adult. You are interested in another adult whom you know and see on a regular basis. I think that asking him out for coffee when you dont have class is probably the way to go.
Keep it casual and low-key and if he says no then ask again in a casual low-key way a week later. If he declines that invite as well, I think being straight up about your feelings and interest in getting to know him better is in order.
What is the absolute worst thing that could happen? If it turns out he is not interested you would be disappointed but could begin to move on--no more Limbo; if he agrees well then there you go.
Be assertive, go for what you want! I know you dont want to "spook" him, but again, you're both adults!! Give him some credit as well as yourself. Relax and bring it out in the open! :)

Good Luck Greeneyedlily, I think you should step outside the cautious polite box you seem to be in and go for what you want! :bgrin2:

Ok, 1st of all, can't do anything after class b/c he ALWAYS drives that kid home like I've already mentioned.



Could you meet up with him at a coffee house after he has dropped of the kid? I agree with Ravenglow...I think you need to get those feelings out there. It's been a couple of weeks now and you are in limbo. I would want to get out of limbo.

I have thought about your observations wesley, and I totally get that, and for some reason I understand it that way, and have probably thought "like society" in the past... double standards suck. We should be european, they're more accepting of social things like that! Ugh! I will talk to him... I'll try to corner him tomorrow before we leave, I really don't want him to retreat! I've invested a lot of emotional and mental energy in this situation and it would be a real shame not to at least persue it further whether it goes the way I want it to or not.

I wouldn't be able to get him to go out afterwards b/c he lives like 30 mins away from the dojo and so does the kid, he lives in the same town out there.... plus it's usually like 8 or later when classes are over... too late for coffee considering he starts work at 7am.

So I chickened out again.... I had about a 20 second opportunity alone with him and I didn't say anything... partially b/c he was figuring something out at the moment, and partially b/c I was afraid to say anything! But he almost seems like HE is the one waiting... it's weird... I'm debating calling him... I know his number is listed in the phone book, but like I've said before, I don't want to come off stalkerish b/c he never actually gave me his number... but on the other hand, I could just say I needed to talk to him so I checked the phone book... that seems honest enough, and someone couldn't really be mad about that could they? :confused:

Personally, I think calling him would be okay. It doesn't seem like you are ever going to get a chance to talk to him alone if you don't. I don't think it is stalkerish to look him up. Maybe talking on the phone will make it easier for him:confused: I am not sure. I can't ever figure out what goes on in the mind of a man:tongue2:

Anyway, what I do know is you have given him...what ...3 weeks now...and still he is being distant. I think it wouldn't be weird if you call him and say you've noticed that things are different between the two of you and ask what is going on.

Just my opinion Lil. Let us know what you decide.

KK

I called him...

and left a message...

AHHH...

"* LONG PAUSE* Hey *** it's **** I just had a question I forgot to ask you earlier, you can call me back at 555-5555"

well he called back! right away actually! LOL he was sleeping! whoops! it's friday night! who goes to bed that early?!?! LOL well i said "i just wanted to ask you if you were free tomorrow or mon and wanted to get some coffee?" and he hesitated for quite awhile (but i had just woken him up, lol) and he told me he was teaching tomorrow, covering for the instructor that usually works sat mornings, and i was like well i've never been to a sat class, so maybe i'll go, and then i was like so what about afterwards? and he said ok, so we're going for coffee after class tomorrow! :D YAY! It took me like 45 mins, my friend on IM screaming at me in large capital letters, and half a bottle of wine to get the courage to call him! Which I'll make some mention of tomorrow, b/c he made the "nervous" comment and I'll put him at ease that he's not the only one nervous here! lol I'm happy! He wouldn't CALL me himself, but i call and he calls RIGHT BACK?! LOL what's up with that?!?! lol oh well! I did it! *pats self on back* now hopefully nothing will come up and deter this!!!

YAY!! ((Pats you on the back...aw...heck, gives you a big hug))You go girl!

The only downside to this is that you'll be up all night thinking about what you are going to say...lol.

Good for you. You know we'll be expecting an update tomorrow afternoon:D

Keeping my fingers crossed for you.

KK

Of course! And hopefully I"ll have a lot to update on!!! :D

Thanks for the hugs and support KK, it was REALLY hard to call him! LOL REALLY hard!!!! But it was worth it and I'm sure just spending some time around him will be a wonderful update in itself! I've been drinking a lot of wine... and now I have to get up early(er) lol so I'll be asleep in a couple hours! heh! I AM excited... I just hope we can get this "stuff" out into the open finally!

Good for you sweetheart!

Big cyber hug & kiss on cheek.

the old guy

Gratz... I was getting frustrated for a while there...

I called him...

and left a message...

AHHH...

"* LONG PAUSE* Hey *** it's **** I just had a question I forgot to ask you earlier, you can call me back at 555-5555"

well he called back! right away actually! LOL he was sleeping! whoops! it's friday night! who goes to bed that early?!?! LOL well i said "i just wanted to ask you if you were free tomorrow or mon and wanted to get some coffee?" and he hesitated for quite awhile (but i had just woken him up, lol) and he told me he was teaching tomorrow, covering for the instructor that usually works sat mornings, and i was like well i've never been to a sat class, so maybe i'll go, and then i was like so what about afterwards? and he said ok, so we're going for coffee after class tomorrow! :D YAY! It took me like 45 mins, my friend on IM screaming at me in large capital letters, and half a bottle of wine to get the courage to call him! Which I'll make some mention of tomorrow, b/c he made the "nervous" comment and I'll put him at ease that he's not the only one nervous here! lol I'm happy! He wouldn't CALL me himself, but i call and he calls RIGHT BACK?! LOL what's up with that?!?! lol oh well! I did it! *pats self on back* now hopefully nothing will come up and deter this!!!

Good for you Lily!! I really don' t think there's anything more difficult that that first phone call. Doesn't matter how you did it, only that you DID IT! For what it's worth, I'm proud of you. He called you right back because he, like you, and very much wants to talk to you. He may not have had the courage to make the first move at this point, but he certainly recognizes an opportunity when he sees one. As far as something coming up "to deter this," don't let it. You've made your connection, don't let go. If circumstances get in the way of coffee today, don't let him get away from you without another date already established. Great job Lily. What a woman!

Waiting to hear more,
Mike

:runnningaround: Yyyyyyyyyeeeeeeeeeeesssssssss! :p

Thanks guys! And Mike, for the record... I can kind of understand why he didn't call now... I really would have chickened out if I hadn't drunken so much wine and had my friend (who is also in a similar AGR) not letting me chicken out again she kept telling me to call him NOW. LOL And if he was half as nervous about the thought of calling as I actually was sitting there with his number in the phone waiting to hit send... then I don't know, I went through fear, panic, feeling queezy, shaking, almost crying... LOL I was CRAZY scared to call! LOL Geez, I really was a piece of work last night! I can't believe all the crazy things that went through my head and my reasons for not calling when he was perfectly nice, and didn't even ask how I got his number! LOL Oh well! I'm leaving for class soon! So keep your fingers crossed! :D

And if he was half as nervous about the thought of calling as I actually was sitting there with his number in the phone waiting to hit send... then I don't know, I went through fear, panic, feeling queezy, shaking, almost crying... LOL I was CRAZY scared to call! LOL Geez, I really was a piece of work last night! I can't believe all the crazy things that went through my head and my reasons for not calling when he was perfectly nice, and didn't even ask how I got his number! :D

... Turns out men and women may have a lot in common when it comes to this relationship stuff. By the way; he doesn't CARE how you got his number. He's just reeeeeeeeal glad you used it. I wouldn't be at all surprised to find out there's a piece of paper with your number on it floating around his house (most likely it's in his wallet) right now. Please keep us posted.

Thinking of you with my fingers crossed,
Mike

Finally! :monkeydance: Keep us posted!:bgrin2:

yes yippee!!! :pianodance::pianodance:
Good for you, green eyes...
let us know what happens...
Lily

Ok.... just got back a little while ago... uh I'm a little depressed but also relieved.... he confided A LOT of personal stuff to me which leaves me still wondering where (and if) this is going now... I mean I found out why he was acting kind of weird and it wasn't me (well maybe it kind of was part of the situation) I promised I wouldn't say anything to anyone so I'm not even going to say here, I'm sorry, but I respect his privacy and the fact that he opened up to me the way he did... STILL don't know where that leaves me.... is he just thinking of me as a friend now or what? He's got some issues to resolve first I guess before anything with us will move forward at all (he didn't say that, but I just know this by the situation he told me). So I don't know, I think at least now I can get him out again, or call him again and not be so afraid... lol and he didn't ask how I got his number and I didn't end up telling him, but he made a comment about sleeping all day tomorrow and I said don't worry I won't call and wake you up again! And then I said something else and was like it took me 1/2 a bottle of wine to do it (don't know if he heard me or not) and then I was like AND 45 mins! He didn't acknowledge me when I said either of those, but I'm sure he HEARD them since some other guy heard me and gave me a look when I said it. AND he wouldn't let me pay! I specifically WANTED to treat him! And he's like "what are you crazy? you had a bowl of soup!" and I'm like "You treated last time, I wanted to treat you!" and he wouldn't let me. LOL Even though I pointed out that I asked him to come out, and he's like "so?" So.... ugh, I don't know. But either way, I feel good that he feels comfortable enough to tell me things and to open up to me the way he did, I just don't know if anything else is going to happen b/c of the "situation" he is now facing.... I did tell him he can call me and he said he knows. So maybe, for a change, he WILL call. I'll probably call him mon afternoon or something and just thank him for lunch and tell him I really liked just hanging out talking to him and that we should definitely do it again soon.

LOL Mike, I really wouldn't think he'd carry my number around in his wallet... maybe it's somewhere in his house since it was on an invitation and a brief note I wrote to him before to invite him to a movie and I wrote it on there.... lol But wouldn't that be something if it WAS in his wallet... I'll tell you he wrote down a number to a chiropractor and even though I've gone several times and have a couple cards, I still keep the one he wrote in my wallet ;) because I am a dork like that.

G-E-L,

Guys in my generation were raised with the notion that a gentleman pays the full bill everytime. That likely explains why your friend insisted on paying the bill, he has old fashioned ethics in regards to outings with ladies.

If your guy has some heavy stuff going on in his life, I have a suggestion for you. Forget about romance for now, and focus on being a friend. Invite him out for a movie one weekend, for a walk in the park the next weekend, etc... Plan simple outings like that which will help take his mind off his problems & help him enjoy life a bit. That is the best expression of "love" you can give him at this time. Laying a foundation of friendship & caring like that will make the romance part a sure thing down the road. It will also give people in your lives a chance to get comfortable with the two of you as friends, which is far easier for people to accept.

big cyber hug.

Dear Greeneyedlily:

Whatever you do, always remember your self worth. Frankly, I don't like his giving you such the cold shoulder. Why can't I have the luck of having a younger woman come after me? I'll probably never find one, but at least - at the moment - I'm not desperate and I have no lessening of my self worth. Remind yourself - as if repeating a mantra - "I deserve the best." :yes:

Well he was the one to kiss me 1st, I just pulled him back for another... thus the basis for confusion.

I was going to try to talk to him, but maybe I shouldn't... in the spirit of laying low... but I wanted to write a message and just give that to him... simply putting:

"Take A Chance" and not saying anymore....

does that sound too corny or pushy? I don't want him to rethink this... I don't want him to be so nervous, but I want to say something to him to encourage him, let him know it's ok to be nervous but you don't have to run away from it!
I was also considering writing something along the lines of :

"When you're ready to take a chance, you know what to do."

Any thoughts or opinions if I should or shouldn't write him a brief message, or what I should/shouldn't say?

The only reason I don't want to lie low is b/c I don't want him to be discouraged... I want him to know I'm ready to go forward and I want to be able to encourage him and let him know I'm not just going to give up that easily. I feel if I laid low or pulled back then he might see that as I'm not serious and I would back down quickly from adversity...

Pasquali, I'm confused.... I didn't like that he "gave me the colder shoulder" sort to speak, but I do UNDERSTAND why he was acting the way he was... so what problem are you seeing with that? Is there some further insight you could provide towards that? Does that mean he thinks less of me? B/c you mentioned self worth, granted most days my self worth is a little shot (from life in general and other things) but I know that I am a good person and I have good qualities that others can appreciate, so I don't really agree that my self worth is in question here....

George, I know what you mean about being the friend and having more simple outings and getting to know you "friendly" type things... I will keep at those, and just allow him to talk to me, and be a shoulder if he needs it. I know that's the best way to go, and in my heart I still believe he has feelings towards me but this new thing really threw him off, and I want to prove that I'm not just some young flirt, I have a mature side and I can be trusted and befriended and offer something to people regardless of their age. I tend to get a long better with people older than me anyways, just in the since that I can't relate to the ways of my peers, things they find ammusing or what not just disgust and annoy me, I'm a liberal person with some conservative morals.

Greeneyedlily:

I apologize for the confusion. I don't like how he treated you. Perhaps he's now treating you more like you deserve. A kiss is an intimate act that shouldn't be followed up by a cold shoulder is what I mean. I'm hoping that everything works out for you....:yes:

I agree with George and your most recent posting. I think playing it cool and just being a friend is the way to go. Besides, it builds a great foundation for a future more intimate relationship. He must feel comfortable with you to confide in you like he did today so you should feel good about that.

Today sounds like a step in the right direction.

Do you feel better now that you know it wasn't just you that he was avoiding because of the kiss that day? I hope it puts your mind at ease.

KK

I still believe he has feelings towards me but this new thing really threw him off, and I want to prove that I'm not just some young flirt.

Lily, between your phone call and your visit, I think he already knows you aren't "just some young flirt." He has trusted you enough to confide some things with you that he hasn't told much of anyone else. I think for most men, the development of that kind of confidence is indeed a very special thing. I think he has feeling for you dear, and they're coming out. Not in the way you'd like, but probably in just the right way to bring the two of you closer. Patience. If the relationship is worth having, then it's also worth waiting for. You're on the right track. Good for you.

Mike

I called him earlier (yesterday) :o I was going to see if he wanted to hang out tomorrow night... I hadn't counted on him actually answering, so I was a little taken aback and didn't even say who I was lol.
I was just like "hey" and he's just like "hey there" and I was like "do you even know who this is?" and he was like "yeah and addressed me by name (or the shortened name he always calls me and is one of the only people to call me that!) hehe then I made some comment about him having caller ID and he's went "something like that" in what I can only imagine his *flirtatiously sarcastic voice* that I adore and can picture him smiling while he talks in! haha! then he said "what's going on?" and I'm like "nothing I justed wanted to call you." and I believe he said something like "that's nice" or whatnot! haha But he knew it was me from my voice! I feel special! It took me 2 hours to get the guts to dial his number! God I'm such a loser! hah! I hadn't had any wine at that time... (hey! it's my explanation for why it took more than twice as long to hit the send button this time!) We only talked briefly about random things until he was interupted by call on his cell... he asked me if I would call him back later... so I wasn't sure what "later" meant and called like 2 1/2 hours later and he didn't answer so I left a message just saying "It's me I was just giving you a call back" ... but I didn't get a call back from him. hmm... :( *sad* Oh well, I'm not stressing... I just hope he wasn't with who I think he might have been with (overheard some mention to a person who's connected with above mentioned "issues") ugh. BUT I was proud of myself for calling him! See and I've already called him once, and we've already hung out just the two of us, and yet I was STILL afraid to call! Like he'd be mad at me for calling! Ridiculous thinking on my part! But I had to be logical and think he wasn't angry that I called him before, he agreed to go out after class with me and HE is the one who suggested lunch over just coffee, HE is the one who opened up and talked to me about all the stuff he did, he picked up the check despite my protests, he hung around and talked to me on tues (oh and the hug! :D he went to let go, but I held on and then he hugged me tighter and kind of just held me:D it was nice!) all these things do not indicate someone who would be upset or bothered that I called him! LOL Pretty sad how I had to argue with my better judgement about this! AND he actually seemed pleasently surprised that I called him.
Oh but I think things are becoming a bit obvious, since I was to meet a guy from class (his g/f, and the g/f's friend) after class (it's become a tues regular where a few of us go out after class) I had stayed and talked to him and texted them that I was leaving and had been chatting with "sensei ****" LOL and when I got there they were totally giving me crap! (Jokingly, of course!) But I was SO embarassed b/c I think they might see some of it... I mean we pretty much stare at eachother openly! LOL It's a wonder no one has said anything before (maybe it's b/c he's very respected by the students and other instructors...?) I think if it was someone else, or another student and myself, they would have tried to set us up point blank or something! I mean I've said this before that sometimes I feel like I HAVE to look away from him b/c I think people are watching him... and uh... he's watching me! so.... yeah! HAH! OOOHHH AND the fact that the g/f of the other student had texted me trying to hook me up with someone she works with and I wasn't really going for him, and she said in one text something about "you like older sensei" and then another one about "not slacking on the older guys" I'm like OMFG! LOL I wonder! I really do wonder! And of course I won't open deny or admit anything, so I was just like "Hey now! Enough of that already!" haha

Ok, well it's late and I'm tired... and I just had to *vent* or whatever you may want to call it, about my little experience, which seems so small and insignificant unless you're in that situation and then it becomes the best part of your day! :rolleyes:

I called him earlier (yesterday)It took me 2 hours to get the guts to dial his number! God I'm such a loser! ...I was proud of myself for calling him! See and I've already called him once, and we've already hung out just the two of us, and yet I was STILL afraid to call! ...I was SO embarassed b/c I think they might see some of it... I mean we pretty much stare at eachother openly! ...my little experience, which seems so small and insignificant unless you're in that situation and then it becomes the best part of your day! :rolleyes:

I really like reading your posts Lily, because right now, you're just soooooo in love. And when I say that, I don't mean to suggest you're getting way ahead of yourself, or placing feelings on your OM that aren't there. You're just putting into words all of those thing we all have gone through (and hopefully will go through again) for the same reasons. You're still anxious because you still don't know where you stand. Pretty typical for the early stages of any relationship, but his responses have all been positive (reluctant but positive) so you're clearly moving in the right direction.
As far as people noticing, I think you can bet on it. People in relationships are so into the relationship that they are usually quite obvious to those around them. That's ok. It might help him to open up more if he sees that the opinions of others don't bother you. It'll certainly help you to get some first-hand experience in dealing with this whole age-gap thing.
Keep plugging baby. I, for one, am very proud of you. You're right, by the way. That kind of experience may be small but it's not insignificant. It's you stepping up and taking the initiative to move your life (and someone else's) in a positive direction, and that's reason enough for it to become the best part of your day.

Always in your corner,
Mike

G-E-L,

as turned on, happy & giddy as you are feeling, your guy is feeling the same thing and enjoying it as much as you are. As much as it made your day, it made his as well.

Big cyber hug, kiss on cheek, pat on back ...

I just had to *vent* or whatever you may want to call it, about my little experience, which seems so small and insignificant unless you're in that situation and then it becomes the best part of your day!

Awwww, that's just so sweet. I'm happy for you.

Guess Who!

Wesley, to clarify, the others that I went out with aren't students, only the one guy is and his g/f and his g/f's friend just come along b/c we've become friends too. So granted, that maybe it is their form of expressing approval of some sorts, LOL they're not students so that probably wouldn't help him. He wasn't there anyways, and I don't plan on telling him what they said unless there's some kind of context in which it would relate to! That might scare him off if he thinks people are onto us. Er, what "us" may or may not be at this point!


George I really hope you're right in your assertations of his feelings!

Mike, I do feel in love, completely transfixed... but not in this "world" kind of love... I was watching Pride and Prejudice last night (my all time favorite book, and movie!) and I realized that people fell in love in different ways, over different things, not as people do today. Whether it were through ones actions or opinions, love seemed easier to assume then than it does now. So I think you're right in that.

I don't know what I should do now though since I called him, he asked that I call him back later, I did so about 2.5 hours and left a message, but he didn't call back that night, or yesterday...? Should I call him AGAIN? I don't want to seem pushy, and I had a reason thought up to use if needed, and didn't, but now I have no real occasion to suggest? Should I wait? I have a feeling if I wait he won't call.... :( But I don't want to seem over zealous by calling him 3 times in a matter of days without his returning the action. Ugh.

I don't know what I should do now though since I called him, he asked that I call him back later, I did so about 2.5 hours and left a message, but he didn't call back that night, or yesterday...? Should I call him AGAIN?

The thing to do is be the same straightforward Greeneyedlily that you've always been. Don't call. Next time you see him at class, walk up and say, "So what's the deal with not answering my call?" Don't be angry. Say it with a smile and let him know that he should have called, but you're giving him an out. The guy's going to take some work Lily, but I can't think of anyone more up to that task than you.

Mike

Wow, I haven't logged on here in a while, and I'm surprised to read that GEL has not unraveled the mystery behind sensei. I must admit that before I went on an AL hiatus, I was looking forward to reading the updates you have, GEL.

Anyway, I hope you don't take this the wrong way, and I'm just offering what I think is going on. Just know that all I want is the best for you. Anyway, I don't feel particularly good about him telling you to call him back, and him not calling you back when you did. I'm pretty sure you've given him enough signals to let him know that you like, but it seems like he's not responding back. It seems like without you doing the effort, this wouldn't have gone anywhere. And while you're doing all the effort, he just accepting your invitations, without really being proactive about it. If your peers have noticed that you have a thing for him, I'm pretty sure that he has noticed that as well. That's a given. What I worry about is that there seems to be an inbalance on who's doing all the work. Has he ever invited you out to dinner, just the two of you? Has he ever called you, out of his own will, not because you called? If the answer is no, I think it's time to think about having a resolution to this - meaning, not just dropping huge signs, but just telling it to him straight up, "Ok, I like you, where do you think this is going?" I mean, not as straight up like, but basically ask him where it's going. To be quite honest, I think the OM is just reciprocating, but not really doing anything about it. I know everything takes time, and that we should be patient, but I hate seeing you go through the agonies of analyzing and overanalyzing every single move he makes. I've been in that situation, so I can totally relate. I remember how much it sucked to be in limbo. And in your situation, it seems like there aren't any clear signals of interest - well, maybe except for the kisses and the hugs. But they're not strong enough though...

Ugh. :( I know you're probably right Sbux, only because it does seem if he was so inclined to share my feelings, he'd make more effort to express them. I understand being uncertain and moving things along slowly, but he's had plenty of time to call and hasn't, granted he does many other little things to the contrary. I think I need to just suck it up and put it out there, in words so there is no misconeption about this any longer, and so that I can know for certain if my heart is worth keeping on the line as I have.

Uhhh.... OK! I'm MORE confused now. Ok, so when it got to the point in class when he was working individually with people, the 1st thing he said to me was that he tried to call me twice but he couldn't make out the last part of my number... he said he listened to it like 80 times to try to figure it out. Mind you, I didn't even bring it up... didn't act any differently towards or anything, he said this to me on his own.

My 1st and initial reaction was to think ok, that's flattering that he kept listening to it to figure it out, and that he attempted to call twice (said some guy answered) lol we joked about that and how I talk too fast at times.

Ok, so that's fine and dandy, maybe he did want to talk to me...

But the cynical side said to me... maybe he just didn't want to call and was using that as an excuse, and contrary to what was said before, he obviously doesn't have my number in his wallet, or even kept the invite I gave him for my party that had my number written in it... So *shrugs* take whar you will out of it. Honestly, I want to take that at face value and he really couldn't hear my number (I do tend to speak quickly normally, but esp quicker when I'm nervous, or have had too much coffee!).

And I laughed at myself earlier b/c I didn't get to hug him goodbye (he was talking to someone else, and I had people waiting for me to meet them, so I didn't wait this time) but he walked out soon after I had already gotten in my car, and then he went to get in the truck but for some reason walked back into the building quickly, but I didn't see him carrying anything out... maybe he went to look up my number on my member card? ;) Who knows... that's all I've got tonight.

I say taking it at face value is good. I'm staying tuned for next weeks installment of GEL's life... This should be getting good!

I say taking it at face value is good. I'm staying tuned for next weeks installment of GEL's life... This should be getting good!

I'm with Zoliepup, and this is only getting started. The next move is clearly his Lily, but if you have to go and drag it out of him then go for it. It looks like your OM is doing some pretty high speed back-stepping, but it's not because of you. I think if you can get him talking about that problem you spoke of, that may be your best way to get close to him. Good luck. Meanwhile, I'm going out for popcorn before next week's episode.

behind you all the way,
Mike

I called him after class when he was on his way home, to leave a message and I said something along the lines of "just so you have my number it's ******* (I said it exageratingly slow, lol) so call me whenever... " (then i fumbled forgetting I was on a machine, lol and quickly said "ok,. bye." heh.

So I think you're right, I want HIM to call me... he has no excuse, the excuse he used about not hearing the number won't hold, so now he just has to WRITE it down where he won't lose it! I don't want to keep chasing him, only to win a tiny bit of a reward for it, like him coming to me saying he tried to call, I want him to just call me like I called him, no reason, just wanted to! Ugh!

I hate this part... I hate being unsure about what to do next, if anything.... ?!:confused:

I hate this part... I hate being unsure about what to do next, if anything.... ?!:confused:

I don't know if this helps at all Lily, but I have a friend who believes that when all of the over-analyzing and hyper-thinking is done, whatever you do (or don't do) IS the right thing. You're a good woman GEL. Whatever happens next, just follow your heart, no matter how crazy it may seem.

Mike

Hey GEL,

It sounds like you're making progress, even though it is painfully slow:eek:

I think it is promising that he mentioned not calling you back because he couldn't understand your number.

In my opinion, all you can do is what you have been doing. Waiting. It's a little like fishing...you have to reel him in slowly, but you'll land him. LOL

Hang in there.

KK

I don't know if this helps at all Lily, but I have a friend who believes that when all of the over-analyzing and hyper-thinking is done, whatever you do (or don't do) IS the right thing.

I'll second that. :) That's the way you have to go without having a reliable textbook for this sort of stuff.

...It's a little like fishing...you have to reel him in slowly, but you'll land him ...

good luck greeneyedlily ...

Guess Who!

http://i245.photobucket.com/albums/gg48/compics/girlfishing.jpg

SO! Omg! WHERE do i start tonight?!?!!

Ok... 1st off, I'll start by saying I haven't had anything to update on since fri when I told him "call me" and he's like "ok" and i was like "i'm holding you to that" and he again was like "ok." WELL.... I didn't hear from him! No excuse now since I left him my number a second time... and the fact that it's not hard for him to look up on the member cards like I said b4! Ugh. Whatever.
I was getting ready to throw in the towel. I was planning to write him a letter expressing my feelings, and confusion after the kiss and the dozens and dozens of little things he's done that made me think that he felt the same as me all this time! I didn't write it physically... just thought about it A LOT the last few days.

FUNNY thing.... My horoscope today said "DON'T THROW IN THE TOWEL JUST YET" yeeaaahhhhh.... b/c I had actually written it on my profile update "i'm throwing in the towel" LOL verbatum!!!!

Now... class started as usual... except when we did this one form where you're standing in a modified squat called a horse stance (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horse_stance) well as we were doing this he was going around checking people's stances... and when he got to me he stood behind me and held me tight against his body for a few seconds to "straighten my back out and reposition my arms" (that wasn't said, that's my observation of what he intended to make it LOOK like he was doing) and since I am amongst the ones in class with the best stances... this was kind of unnecessary contact... PLUS he didn't do it to anyone else.... LOL it was OBVIOUSLY a way to come into physical contact with me.... b/c it sure didn't feel like he was showing me anything, it felt more like when a b/f or g/f comes up behind you and holds you close to them! :yes: *sigh*

Ok... that's fine... maybe he WAS just "correcting me" lol later on after that there was this partner activity where we had to do this self defense stuff and it's a continual activity, basically doing as much as you can and as many applications as you can figure out.... lol well when it came to him and I working together it was basically us screwing around rolling on the ground, our arms were and legs were tangling together, and were just having fun and smiling and he felt more like he just wanted to be near me and just have my body against him in any way he could, lol I know that probably sounds odd if you've never been in this situation with the physical contact involved in this sport.... but yeah there's a certain difference with him than there is with other people, and I don't think I'm interpreting this wrong here!

SOOOO... when we were leaving, I mentioned him coming out with us (some of us go out after class on tues, it's become our weekly thing) and he declined i forget his reason, and i was like "awe you never come out with us anymore" *insert pouty face here* and he explained about how good he's been with his diet (health reasons, not weight). And so then I asked him his opinion on whether or i should cut my hair or let it grow out... (it's already ready QUITE long, but i want it longer, like to my waist/hips and I'm about 5 inches shy) and he's like keep growing it, you have such nice hair etc LOL so there's more iniciative (i want my hair long long again and was secretly HOPING he liked my long hair! :bgrin2:)

So, then as we were leaving... (and this was totally unexpected b/c he didn't stare at me like he usually does and all that so I was confused between what he did during class and that he wasn't playing those eye contact games like usual...) WELL... he went right in and pecked me on the lips! :runnningaround: Quick like before... BUT HE did it nonetheless! How do I throw in the towel NOW??? Obviously he still has some kind of feelings for me or he wouldn't have done that! or the other things he did tonight! And as much as I want to stop playing this game and talk openly about what is going on, what he's done, what I've done, what I want and what he wants... I don't think I'm ready to, and I don't think he is ready to either... since he's not even ready to call me! UGH! I'm SOOOO confused, but I'm happy at what happened tonight!!!!

Oh and the people I went out with (and usually go out with tuesdays) obviously suspect something! The 1st thing they said when I came in was that I looked like I had "sensei sex hair"!! LMFAO! OMFG!!!! And I try to blow it off and laugh at it as just playful teasing b/c I hang around and talk to him, but they were ALL making comments about he's cute for an older guy and I mean saying things that were "encouraging" but playful and I was just trying to not completely deny that I liked him, but just not saying anything to confirm their suspicions! oy vey!!! ;)

G-E-L

I luv ya sweetheart .... you are wacky!

I don't know which one of you is driving the other more crazy!

He's driving you crazy, you're driving him crazy.

I hope you're enjoying the journey sweetheart, because I'm sure enjoying reading about it!

the old guy

This is great GEL. I just love reading the latest news, you inspire me, girl!! :D

Maybe one day I'll get off my bum and do something about my OM :rolleyes:

G-E-L

I hope you're enjoying the journey sweetheart, because I'm sure enjoying reading about it!



I agree.

Keep with the patience. Slow and steady wins the race.

KK

So... after spending the last part of the week thinking about how to lay one on him after class.... I was foiled again. How you ask? Oh this time I dislocated my knee. NOT pretty. This happened to me before when I was in HS... worst pain I have ever felt. Absolutely terrible, the pain that makes you almost wish someone had a bid club to just hit you over the head with. Yeah had to be taken to the ER by ambulence etc (they finally gave me something for the pain AFTER I got there!) It was not a fun night at all... I'm not getting into all of the details, ask me in PM if you really care for that.... I'm just stoned from the pain pills right now so I'm making this brief... I will mention that in a room full of guys none of them were very comforting! (Although apparently the sight of my leg had freaked them out a bit! lol) Except for OM who was basically the one to take charge of the situation making the calls etc and when I asked that he sit near me he did so. The other surprising thing he did was after the ambulence came (he couldn't reach my dad who was supposed to have gone out, but was actually still home but asleep) he left and WENT to the place I told him he said he was going tonight! Not to mention he called me at like 9 this morning (woke me up, but it was him so I could care less!) to see how I was and we just talked for like 20 mins or so... and I had thanked him for going off to find my dad like he did (how many people would really do that? I'm old enough that I could have gone to the hospital by myself, lol) and at one point when I was apologizing for the yelling and whatnot he made some comment about how "it's ok we still love you." and it was the way he said it that touched me, b/c we might be like family there, but his voice saying it so SINCERELY, took every ounce of will power from screaming "I LOVE YOU too!" back lol. I wanted to say it, that "I loved them too" maybe I'll say it next time I talk to him (or even in class, since I'll be going to hang out for awhile) just to make sure he knows I care about everyone there, and especially him.

Ouch!

sympathy & cyber hugs for the knee sweetheart.

hurry up & mend.

Geo

...maybe I'll say it next time I talk to him (or even in class, since I'll be going to hang out for awhile) just to make sure he knows I care about everyone there, and especially him.

Ok Lily I need some details. Are you on crutches? Did they put you in a knee immobilizer (that's one of those braces that doesn't bend at the knee)? I only ask because we may be able to make this work to your advantage. The more debilitated you are, the more we may be able to get him to act like a hero. This, by the way, is a good thing. Ok, so details please.

Mike

LOL details? Well the details are that yes I'm in an imobilizer and yes I'm on crutches (don't know the extent of the damage to the tendions b/c I haven't seen the specialist yet) lol can't bend my knee at all at this point b/c it's swollen like 4x the size and I'm moving pretty slowly (having to use my arms to move my leg around a bit), however, I'm a pro at crutches (heh - accident prone) ... how do you propose I make this work for me? Considering he lives about 25 mins away and that's why I only see him at class? (he does work a little bit closer to me though) I was thinking of calling him tomorrow and saying I was stuck in the house and was lonely and bored and just wanted to talk to him and maybe at some point mention that I wouldn't mind visitors etc since I have 19 stairs and it's quite a task to try to leave as I learned earlier today...

So now that you know the details (I assume those were the ones you were looking for...) what's the plan? What kind of strategy are we talking about? How do we bring out the hero? lol ;) And you didn't mention if his rushing off like he did to find my dad (when he couldn't get him on the phone) was a good thing...? I mean I'm not a child so I could have gone alone... does that show extra concern or is that normal reaction for anyone?

I was thinking of calling him tomorrow and saying I was stuck in the house and was lonely and bored and just wanted to talk to him and maybe at some point mention that I wouldn't mind visitors etc since I have 19 stairs and...

You're way ahead of me dear. You've got that huge immobilizer, and those great crutches, that say, "I'm a poor, helpless woman. Save me." Call him like you said in your post. Talk about being lonely and bored. tell him you really, really, really want to go to next class, but just don't know how you could get a ride. When he shows up, tell him it's really difficult to get down the stairs, and would probably go better if you could put an arm over his shoulder. Give him the opportunity to be a hero to you. He stepped up when you got hurt. My bet is, he'll do it again.

Mike

P.S. By the way; I don't buy that "poor, helpless woman" business in you any more than anyone else who knows you from this forum, but if it works, go for it!

You're right Mike, I don't even like to be helped. I was telling my friends last night who kept asking if they could get something or whatnot and I'm like "ok here's how it is... I'm sandra bullock in 28 days, and I should be wearing a sign that says confront me if I don't ask for help!" LOL I'm too independent for my own good, the only time I LIKE to be babied is when I'm perfectly fine, don't patronize me or give me the pity card b/c I'm hurt, I HATE that! And HE knows that b/c he's been there b4 when I've gotten other minor injuries and I think I told him as much, so he asks if I'm ok, flashes those concerned eyes that say "are you telling me the truth?" and usually can read me if I'm telling him the truth or not... ha when I'm not he will tell me to sit down or go stretch or something... PLUS I drive... and I live just minutes away from the building so I wouldn't really NEED his help... plus my dad lives below me... so that would be the "man who should help" I guess when you think of it that way... which is probably why he hasn't stepped up more, and I get that. But I'm still going to call him later, ,maybe talk about all this wonderful snow we're having and say now I'm REALLY not getting out much! lol

You're right Mike, I don't even like to be helped. I was telling my friends last night who kept asking if they could get something or whatnot and I'm like "ok here's how it is... I'm sandra bullock in 28 days, and I should be wearing a sign that says confront me if I don't ask for help!" LOL I'm too independent for my own good, the only time I LIKE to be babied is when I'm perfectly fine, don't patronize me or give me the pity card b/c I'm hurt, I HATE that! And HE knows that b/c he's been there b4 when I've gotten other minor injuries and I think I told him as much, so he asks if I'm ok, flashes those concerned eyes that say "are you telling me the truth?" and usually can read me if I'm telling him the truth or not... ha when I'm not he will tell me to sit down or go stretch or something... PLUS I drive... and I live just minutes away from the building so I wouldn't really NEED his help... plus my dad lives below me... so that would be the "man who should help" I guess when you think of it that way... which is probably why he hasn't stepped up more, and I get that. But I'm still going to call him later, ,maybe talk about all this wonderful snow we're having and say now I'm REALLY not getting out much! lol

(sigh!)...Lily, you're missing the point. This isn't about you actually needing the help. It's about giving HIM the opportunity to step up and get closer. If he knows how independent you are, so much the better. He'll see it for what it really is, an obvious come-on. Then it becomes a question of what will he do next. Since the two of you are bent on driving each other crazy, here's your next available opportunity. Looking forward to the next episode.

your friend,
Mike

Ok, I give up. I really do. Maybe that's what all this was about... I need to give up on him and I needed to get away from karate and him... it's the only thing I can think of. Yes he called me on sat, but not after that, I called him last night (it was only 9) I don't know if he was already sleeping or just not there (I do know he goes to bed kind of early) but he hasn't called me back. I didn't leave my number on the machine, but obviously he had it since HE called me sat... and why you would throw out someone's number that you cared about, I don't know, so that means he would have still had it, so I give up! He doesn't want to talk to me and that should be perfectly obvious by all the signs. I'm through, I'm done pining over a man who doesn't want me, and probably only acted the way he did the other night b/c he's a nice guy, he probably would have done that for anyone else, esp if they were children, which it's becoming clear that THAT is the way he thinks of me since he has called me a kid a few times, and even said that AFTER I told him the last time I hated it... SO he sees me as a child who needed her dad when she was hurt and went to find him b/c he's a nice guy. The other stuff... I can't explain except maybe it just gave him an ego boost that a young lady was interested in him and flirting with him in such an obvious way. I don't think he could care about me like I care about him, or want the same things I wanted... he'd probably be happier going back to his ex who he already stated he still had feelings for when he told me about her trying to get him back recently after a couple years apart. So that's it, I just need to walk away... I can't wait around hoping he'll come around anymore. If he cared he would have called me again to check on me, he would have returned my call, he would have stopped by (thats not an odd thing to do when someone is sick or injured!) but he hasn't. I think I'll write him that letter... it was nice while it lasted, but I can't go on with this flirting and innocent kisses and continue to wish and hope things will go further, he's a man and if he wanted me, he would come and get me. I've chased him too long as it is... so the whole him persuing a younger woman is no longer a valid concern, now it's just about not requiting the same feelings. :witsend:

Best not to write him anything... Let it go... Who knows what the universe has reserve for you. Good luck!

G-E-L,

You're upset sweetheart. You're in pain, your mobility is limited, your patience is shot, this is not a good time in your life, and you're in no mood to make decisions. Wait until you are no longer upset before you make a decision. At least sleep on it overnight.

Then, before you do anything, we need to discuss your options.

For now, take care of that leg, & more importantly take care of G-E-L.

luv ya, George

Ok, I give up. I really do. Maybe that's what all this was about... I need to give up on him and I needed to get away from karate and him... it's the only thing I can think of. Yes he called me on sat, but not after that, I called him last night (it was only 9) I don't know if he was already sleeping or just not there (I do know he goes to bed kind of early) but he hasn't called me back. I didn't leave my number on the machine, but obviously he had it since HE called me sat... and why you would throw out someone's number that you cared about, I don't know, so that means he would have still had it, so I give up! He doesn't want to talk to me and that should be perfectly obvious by all the signs. I'm through, I'm done pining over a man who doesn't want me, and probably only acted the way he did the other night b/c he's a nice guy, he probably would have done that for anyone else, esp if they were children, which it's becoming clear that THAT is the way he thinks of me since he has called me a kid a few times, and even said that AFTER I told him the last time I hated it... SO he sees me as a child who needed her dad when she was hurt and went to find him b/c he's a nice guy. The other stuff... I can't explain except maybe it just gave him an ego boost that a young lady was interested in him and flirting with him in such an obvious way. I don't think he could care about me like I care about him, or want the same things I wanted... he'd probably be happier going back to his ex who he already stated he still had feelings for when he told me about her trying to get him back recently after a couple years apart. So that's it, I just need to walk away... I can't wait around hoping he'll come around anymore. If he cared he would have called me again to check on me, he would have returned my call, he would have stopped by (thats not an odd thing to do when someone is sick or injured!) but he hasn't. I think I'll write him that letter... it was nice while it lasted, but I can't go on with this flirting and innocent kisses and continue to wish and hope things will go further, he's a man and if he wanted me, he would come and get me. I've chased him too long as it is... so the whole him persuing a younger woman is no longer a valid concern, now it's just about not requiting the same feelings. :witsend:


Maybe he called you kid because he is aware of his feelings for you, but has not fully accepted them yet, so calling you "kid" is a way of wanting to repress those feelings he has. Just a thought.

The fact that he still has feelings for his ex is the most important factor here, I think. You definitely want someone to be fully with you - you seem like a very bright and nice woman who certainly deserves a man who will give his heart only to you. He might very well have genuine feelings for you and he certainly has respect for you and for himself, because he is not making any moves on you until he is 100% clear about his feelings.

Thanks Romantic, I never really thought about the "kid" thing like that... I'm sure he respects me and maybe that has something to do with why he hasn't made a "real" move on me... but I suspect he is back with his ex-fiance since he was in a hurry AND looked good tonight when he was leaving... didn't even want to stick around and talk... and claimed he never got the message I left him... so I think it is time that I write him a letter and get it all out, since there isn't anything to lose and if need be I can just NOT go and hang out there until I'm ready to get back into it. And by that time there shouldn't be the awkwardness of seeing eachother regularly. But it's hurting