Date situation

Hi to all,

I haven't been around for a while due to work issues but I'm back now and asking once more for your opinion.

Ok, quick refresher. Remember I told you I currently work in the army and this cadet asked me out. I am 28 and he is 22. I didn't think it was a good idea to date him (had some issues of my own and plus it could jeopardize my job). Anyway, he is not in the army any longer and asked me out again. I initially gave him my phone number and left it at that and as one would expect he started calling and texting me. We had great conversations over the phone, great sense of humor and all that and we decided to meet up for coffee.

Date night, we meet up, we go to this great place and we start talking. Half way through the conversation he tells me he likes me a lot and he expected an answer. I told him that I like him as well but that I am the type of person that takes things slow and that I would like to get to know him a bit better. Also I told him up front that I am a relationship type of person and that he should also bear this is in mind.

And here is where the good part starts. He tells me "I thought you were going to mention our age gap but you didn't". I said "It is not a problem for me but since you mention it, then it means you are thinking about it and so I would like to hear your take on things". He said that when he flirted with me he thought I was barely 25 (I look younger) and that when he found out I was 28 he was shocked. He said that he would have preferred if I were younger. To that I responded that "age is not something that can be changed and so it is a thing either you accept or you don't". So, he started telling me about his ex older girlfriend (of barely 2 years PLEEEEEASE) and how she hurt him and all that and that "he has changed as a person and doesn't know how much he can give". He also said that:

"you are a very decent person with principles and I am confused. If you were one of these cheap women I wouldn't have a problem because it would all be for sex but you are not one of them. I have met decent girls since my breaking up with my ex girlfriend but avoided going out with them. I had casual sex with girls who knew I was not in for a relationship. Also we are in very different stages of our lives, you have somewhat planned out your life so far but I'm at the beginning of my career and I don't know how this age gap is eventually going to evolve. I don't want things to get sour eventually". I asked him if he was concerned about marriage and whether I would eventually ask him to marry me or something like that and he agreed.

And after that, he grabbed me and tried to kiss me and was all touchy feely (to an extreme degree).

I simply said that all those things are things that he has to grapple with, and there is nothing I could do to help. I didn't get into the position of "pursuer" or "rescuer" or anything like that. I kept the conversation factual, and then after a decent amount of time wished him good night.

After that he kept calling me and we still chatted over the phone. After all nothing happened right? (don't answer that, we all know that something did happen but getting angry or defensive and hanging up on him is childish) BUT I know that he will eventually ask me out again. Basically, he keeps calling to chat with me but he is not mentioning anything about us. And the funny thing is that there is NO US. I haven't promised him anything, we are not in a relationship and definitely I'm not waiting for him to make a decision as to whether he does want to date me or not. And this is something I said on our first date.

Anyway, is it just me or do you all get the feeling that this guy just went out with me to check out whether he could have a casual relationship with me (mainly sex) with no commitment whatsoever and kind of explained that he is not really looking for something more serious? Because the more I think of it, it doesn't make sense! Why go into so much trouble to say those things if he was REALLY into me and wanted to start something decent? All these disclaimers from date one???

So I would really like to hear your take on things.


thank you


ayla

On the surface, yes it sounds like perhaps he was simply "testing the water" to see what would happen (i.e. casual/sex).

However, it could also be that he's processing some thoughts/feelings externally by talking through them. It may be that he's confused by suddenly feeling like he might want a relationship when he hasn't in the past.

It never hurts to make another friend - you might consider continuing to communicate, and if it leads to friendship wonderful, and if it leads to more, well, you can just take it slow.

Hi Tigerlilly,

Well this is why I haven't stopped talking to him because it never hurts to make a new friend as you say. So I'm simply letting him process whatever he needs to process without pursuing a relationship and just see what happens.

ayla

Maybe I'm a romantic fool...well okay, no maybe's about it...heh...but yeah, I think he initially attempted something to see what he could get away with. When it became clear the answer was 'not much', he still couldn't get you out of his head.

I would be very, very careful though. If this was me, he stays in the friend box until he not only tells you he's ready for more, but backs it up with deeds.

Anyway, is it just me or do you all get the feeling that this guy just went out with me to check out whether he could have a casual relationship with me (mainly sex) with no commitment whatsoever and kind of explained that he is not really looking for something more serious? Because the more I think of it, it doesn't make sense! Why go into so much trouble to say those things if he was REALLY into me and wanted to start something decent? All these disclaimers from date one???

I think he was just testing the waters. I think he's a player, but plays a fair game...so when he realized that you had principles, he really was in a pickle. At that point I think he told you what you wanted to hear and in a weird way, this calling and texting you is his way of paying penance. I think he is genuinely attracted to you and likes you, but is way too hung up on the age difference for this to lead to a real relationship, if and when he is ready for one.

Roz, the term 'playa' went through my head as well, hence my caution. However, I am willing to give the guy the benefit of the doubt, though he ought to still have to earn the friendship badge, nevermind anything else.

Why don't you just ask him what's up? Put it as bluntly to him as you have to us and let him explain what he was and is looking for. The guy sounds honest, I am sure he won't have a problem telling you.

He's worried about the age gap? *confused* What age gap?

He's worried about the age gap? *confused* What age gap?

Ha, this is exactly what I was thinking. Maybe he's grasping onto any miniscule issue as a future escape hatch.

I think you are being very smart and keeping your own emotional safety in mind by maintaining a bit of distance and allowing him to take responsibility for himself.

Sounds like this guy has some issues -- just doesn't sound sincere. If he's confused, ok, I can understand that, but to use your age as an excuse for anything is ridiculous. You're only 6 years older than he is. There is no age gap.

I'm sure you're a beautiful, smart, accomplished young woman. Why not just concentrate on yourself and keep your conversations with him short. Before you know it, the kind of guy you deserve will come into your life. After that, you'll think back on the "date" you had with Mr. Confused, and wonder why you spent any of your energy trying to figure the whole thing out.

You're going to be fine. Time and patience work wonders if we just give them a chance.

Personally I wouldn't want to be friends with a man who divided women into "cheap" and "decent" but that's me.

Yeah, I think he was testing the waters for sex. You told him you were the relationship type, he responded with some bizarre song and dance that basically said he'd been having sex while avoiding relationships. His whole "different stages of life" speech sounded like a big euphemistic code for "I want you but you better not expect anything from me."

He sounds like the kind of YM I sometimes run into who thinks an OW (and while I don't think you have a serious age gap, he clearly does) is an easy sexual resource. I've found certain young guys have an almost courtesan-like view of older women, in which we're not "cheap" girls in their eyes but we're not relationship material either; we're somewhat respectable but still there to basically provide sex and comfort and friendship without expecting anything from them in return.

Hello to all,

Thank you all for your replies. This is an update on what finally happened with the guy.

He kept calling me daily but when I paid attention to his conversation it was always kept casual and in the "friendly box". We had a laugh but there was no progression. In fact, he kept the conversations very short. That was fine with me but after a while I started thinking to myself "hang on a second! if he was really crazy about me he wouldn't have had me waiting for almost two weeks without giving me a straight answer". To be honest, I wanted to talk to him about it earlier and "clear the air" but I though that since he "asked for time" he should get it. He then vanished for a couple of days and when I texted him to ask how he's been he replied in a very matter of fact/void of emotion way.

Anyway, it became apparent that he blatantly avoided seeing me and made silly excuses the "I'm crazy busy" type. So finally, the day before yesterday I decided that this is taking far too long. I rung him up to ask him out. He initially said "yes" but rung me up a couple of minutes later with some stupid excuse. Since he is currently staying with another ex cadet he claimed that his friend would go out and stay out late and so he wouldn't be able to "find" him afterwords (yea, cause Athens is so huge, there are no mobiles, no taxis etc and so people frequently get lost since we use the starts for navigational purposes!! excuse my sarcasm)

I simply told him in a friendly manner that since he will be leaving for his hometown in less than a week I wanted to clear the air about our coffee meeting. So he said that he wanted to talk to me face to face about it and not over the phone but didnt think he could get the time but he would try and make some to see me. He implied that we could even talk about it after his holidays (yeah, right. He's off to his hometown for 3 weeks. I don't think a single date justifies THAT much waiting). I said that there was no need and politely probed saying that I kind of got what he wanted to tell me and that it was ok to briefly discuss it over the phone.

Here starts the good part he said "are you absolutely sure you know what I wanted to talk about?" (playful tone) I said "well, you were perfectly clear when we last met, I don't think you wish to pursue a relationship with me but just be friends". He said "and you are not angry or dissappointed??" (now, the tone of voice just for the record was quite condescending it is not what he said it is HOW he said it).

And then he continued "well, I don't want you to think that I am a coward and I was avoiding you but I was very busy, are you sure you are ok? I didn't want to have this conversation over the phone and that is why I made sure I wasn't too friendly or too rude when I spoke to you on the phone but just neutral so I wouldn't make you take the initiative and ask me what is going on". (is this stupid or what?? its the "hide under the carpet" mentality) I said "well, nothing happened so why shouldn't I be ok with it?" and at that point he became quite defensive, like he expected me to fall apart or something. He even said so. Actually he thought that most women would fall apart at this! I ended the discussion politely after that.

Now, I obviously never found out what really bothered him but I guess it was the age gap or a lot of other things. But to be honest I thought at almost 23 he would have had at least the nerve to tell me sooner.

The following day, he visited the camp although he had no reason to be there! He made sure he came round at break time and saw me. I was very friendly and you could see it in his mannerisms that he hoped I would be upset or angry. I guess being an extremely good looking guy, he thought I would be inwardly very very upset and that I was lying to him on the phone about being ok with the situation. We talked only of trivialities, I was polite but left him to himself soon after.

So, this is the situation. Actually there is no situation. The guy pursued me for 6 whole months and then decided I was "too old" after one date. This could be an excuse also I guess the main reason is that he wanted instant sex, or the promise of a casual relationship. He didn't get it and so that was the end of it.

I am ok with it and quite happy I never got to go out with him. He was not worth it I'm sorry to say.

ayla

The guy's an idiot. Don't waste any more time worrying about him! :dummy!:

Take care!

I think this was a case of someone who was mildly attracted to you, but when he found out the "parameters of your standards" so to speak, i.e. you were not interested in a "friendship with sex" type of arrangement, then he backed off.

He was still attracted to you and still liked you to some degree, he just didn't want to lead you on because he knows that's not what you're about. Simple. He did you a favor by not pursuing you past what you presented to him. Doesn't mean he didn't like you, hence the few more phone calls. This was just a learning experience for both of you; you interacted, it wasn't for either one of you. No good guy/bad guy here.

Or he is a big jerk. This guy has so many red flags I don't know where to begin.
Just the fact alone that he classifies women into two categories is pretty telling and frankly, what age gap? He is full of crap and wants to keep you on the back burner "just in case".

Guys that love you let you know that in no uncertain terms and don't disappear, make lame excuses etc... You deserve better than this guys crumbs :yes:

Hi Chat Cat,

I did agree up to a point with Marshmallow that he was mildly attracted to me and all that and that he just didn't want to lead me on but I kind of changed my mind after yesterday and our encounter in the camp. As I said his whole demeanour was one of "checking out for himself" whether I was honest about telling him that I wasn't upset. I would have understood it if he came round to see me just for the sake of showing me that we are "friends" but it kind of ended up in me talking friendly and him flirting quite openly and aggressively.And it was not nice.

I do understand that people have the right to NOT want to be in a relationship and that's ok. BUT it is another kettle of fish when they come to your workplace and exert their sexuality in front of other people. It is a good thing that I followed everybody's advice here and didn't date him unti he got his degree and left the camp for good. Otherwise it would have been a case of him flirting and flirting and me feeling very uncomfortable and worried that everybody would find out. And that would be horrible. I got a taste of it yesterday and didn't like it at all!!!

I don't demonise the guy in any way at least he was "honest" about his intentions in a roundabout way. But it was a learning experience for me and I'm grateful for it because now I won't be tempted to ever date another cadet, or officer again. Dating workmates is risky. Also another thing. I know that the 6 year age gap was nothing to me but in my cultoure, unfortunately, people still cannot cope with the idea that an older woman could ever seriously date a younger guy. That is why you frequently hear horror stories about women having to lie about their age and pretty,much revealing it almost at the altar! That's why I got a lot of negative comments through friends when I told them about him. My male friends quipped and said "he just wants sex" and some of my female friends said "you should have told him you were 25". To my mind, this is manipulation of the worst kind. At the end of the day this is me and I won't lie. And obviously I won't change my taste in men. I like younger guys and in time the right one will come along. This forum is the living proof that age is nothing but a number.

So thank you all again for your advice and for the opportunity you gave me to express myself honestly and without bias.

ayla