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Thread: AGRS with VYM

  1. #31
    eponavet's Avatar
    eponavet is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by special K View Post
    MisKryp.... Wow, you went WAY back to ressurect this thread!

    It was kinda sad, though, reading through the posts and realizing that many of these couples are no longer together...

    Your telling your guy that he is "free to do what he wants" is a gift to him. When one partner clutches, the relationship is doomed, I believe...no matter WHAT ages the partners are!

    I did a count...to the best of my knowledge, 10 of the posters are STILL in their relationships almost 2 years later, 3-4 are question marks (n/a posts and such) and 5-6 are definite no's.

    So, I think it would be a lot nicer to point out that a majority of these relationships are still going well...and that this thread actually has an above average rate of successful relationships as it stands today.

    And....it wasn't surprising to see a very critical post about vym....I am thinking that just recently you posted saying you don't remember drawing distictions so harshly against people under 25....maybe I'm wrong ...

    Hardest issue to deal with:
    A majority of vym can go through a confusion-period, or begin to have ambivalent feelings about the AGR after a couple of years with you as they get closer to their early to mid-20's, especially if you were their first significant "adult relationship" and/or they were in their teens when you got together. Many need to stretch on their own to gain autonomy down the road, and that can be heartbreaking for both of you since he may still profess his love, but he just needs to figure things out on his own. It seems that if you can ride out about 5 years and are still together past their early 20's, chances increase that things will work out long term (if that's what you both want).
    Even then it can still happen as one dear member here is dealing with now:

    http://www.agelesslove.com/boards/sh...ad.php?t=21896

    There are relatively very few ladies here who are still with their ym after 5+ years (who were inititally 18-20 when they first got together) and many of those dealt with this phase with their guys...and thankfully survived. Some let their guy "go" to find their autonomy and they ultimately came back, others got couple's counseling, etc....but the ride was not easy. Unfortunately, many, if not most, do not survive the need-for-autonomy stage with their vym.
    My suggestion is to pick the brains of the ladies who have made it through to get advice on how to make it work, if long term is what you're wanting: Jo-admin, Bella, and Toasty to name a few of the "5-plusers" . And if long term is not something you even care about, I say ENJOY POINTS 1-6 I listed at the beginning of this post and be thankful for every day, because they are very special while you have them.
    Best....Karen
    I'd also be interested to hear from our relatively few ladies who are still with their ym (I'm thinkng that based on the active poll about ym/longevity, it might not be relatively few at all...) and find out how many had to deal with the "need for autonomy" phase and if it was any different form any other relationship where one person needed some space (in other words...better or worse than previous relationships with either another younger partner, or perhaps a same age partner who grew apart for various reasons that could not be contributed to a still developing brain or whatever...).
    Last edited by eponavet; 08-27-2007 at 09:45 PM.
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  2. #32
    MisKryptonite Guest

    Talking resurrection.....lol

    [QUOTE=special K;502899]MisKryp.... Wow, you went WAY back to ressurect this thread![QUOTE]

    Sorry K (not really lol)...but you have no idea how much sense this made to me.... and to a lot of others I'm sure. It may be an old thread, but a lot of people in new relationships can benefit from the advice passed on through it!

    I'm not so much into telling my guy he can be free... that would probably come out like mothering...lol I just let him tell me his dreams and ambitions (and crazy thoughts!) and I encourage them... I never say "well gee, where does that leave me?" I never drag myself into his thoughts, I leave them open so he can think of my role in it himself...if there is one. He does some "teen spazzing" ( I LOVE that!) and gets all looney , but I guess, being VYM, sometimes he does care what other people think...too bad what he anticipates is usually worse than what happens!
    This last little adventure to Yosemite, he went alone...he wanted to do this alone... I voiced my concerns..(and didn't care if they seemed motherly!), he respected them and did everything he could to assure me he had this under control. I was a wreck while he was gone, especially the 3 days he had no cell service and had to hike miles to a pay phone! Not because I worried about him, but because I MISSED him terribly! ... He doesn't know I was a wreck...or at least HOW MUCH of a wreck I actually was...lol I told him, "Yeah, a couple days ago,... I lost it a little bit"... and he laughed, probably knowing I was a hysterical "chick" of a wreck everytime I picked up one of his shirts...LOL
    Last night I suprised him at the airport (he had his own truck to get home because being independent, he drove himself to the airport...probably had nothing to do with not wanting to see me cry when he was leaving...lol ), the look on his face was priceless, he literally dropped his bag and gave me the biggest PDA kiss I've ever gotten...lol
    People were actually staring...we didn't care
    Anyway... I'm sorry for those who posted and didn't quite make it...my philosophy on this is like others here... I will love him forever, but will keep him only as long as he wants to stay...and be thankful for the opportunity to have such a love in my life.
    I hope this helps or encourages others to hang in there...nothing is perfect, but this, (for me) is SO worth the trouble!

  3. #33
    special K's Avatar
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    It IS ABSOLUTELY nice that some are still together (I just counted only ~6 from this thread with vym 18-21 at first, but I've been wrong before!).

    And the reason I stated it was sad, was because I was reflecting back - having gone through a few of the breakups of the others here on the boards- as they worked through alot of heartbreak and confusion. THOSE are sad memories...but, I know that some of those ladies have moved on and are happier now..so that's happy.

    Semantics probably.

    Even in 2005 I wasn't citical of very young men..never have been, never will be. If you reread my post back then you will see that I start out with 6 points why being with a vym is SO AMAZING !! I thought it was amazing (they are amazing) then, and I still think it is now.

    Yes, I have always offered a view from my perspective (and the perspective of many others I've known on the board and in real life who have experienced the same situations/ confusion/ struggles unique to loving a vym, chatted with me for hours on IM aobut it, on the phone, in pm's over the years, etc.). IMO, it's important to point out the possible challenges, unique dymanics in a vyo/op partnership, and encourage time for steady growth of the relationship. And, yes, I feel it is a postive to be aware that all young people (men and women)who discover their own autonomy/independence as young adults first can only strenghten a potential relationship later. Go slow, and be honest/open and aware....that has been my take, not "there's no hope for relationships with vyp". I don't think any of those components could harm or discourage any relationship.

    As I recall, the women who are still with their vym after a few years have posted about their "bumps" with their guys at a point when they were confused or considering another idependent path....some sought counseling- and it helped...some waded through the time on their own, and made it out the other side. But again, many, many have not. I don't want to mention names, and I won't on a public thread...but if you need to know, epo, pm me.

    MisKryp: You are right on the money that old threads can still offer current advice that benefits everyone...I just thought the thread was old, but not all the way back to 2005, so I was happily shocked

    I will love him forever, but will keep him only as long as he wants to stay...and be thankful for the opportunity to have such a love in my life.
    I hope this helps or encourages others to hang in there...nothing is perfect, but this, (for me) is SO worth the trouble!
    I LOVE this, what you said, and I totally AGREE! Mine didn't last, but now, in hindsight, it was "so worth the trouble"..
    "What the caterpillar sees as the end of the world, the butterfly calls wings."

  4. #34
    MisKryptonite Guest

    VYM's

    Special K.... I read your list of VYM items...that's what prompted me to hit this thread! The things you said were SO true. You hit every word I would use to describe what my reasons are. Sometimes it's so hard to put into words, when people ask me why i would "waste my time playing in kindergarten" (yes, someone actually said that to me!).
    I believe having a relationship with a VYM is quite challenging... I don't want to offend anyone by saying it's tougher than others, but it does have some issues you might not run into with people in their mid to late 20's.
    We all say that we shouldn't care what other people think or say, but when you are 18-23, what people think & say matter to you. It's a hard place to be in life where you have to make decisions that maybe you're not prepared for.
    I know from my own VYM, he likes having someone around him that is stable and strong, but not controlling or judgemental... someone who can lean on HIM from time to time, but not smother him with desperation or dump a ton of baggage on him.
    They do have different issues and have a few more "growing pains" than older guys. Not one thing works for everyone...and like I said, this is one heck of a ride...just hold on and breathe!

  5. #35
    Polly's Avatar
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    It sure is a heck of a ride, with a vym, and for the first five years, I was riding with my hands up in the air and a smile on my face. The last two, I was about to hurl over the side.

    All the good things happened in our relationship. We loved much, we laughed often, sex was absolutely phenomenal, we too touched eachother each time we passed by, we finished eachother's sentences, we went out looking like a "hot" couple, we had the world by the *****.

    The sixth year into it, things just began to fall apart. His need for autonomy, my need for financial security, my kids getting older and being pains-in-the-*****, and, unfortunately, his inability to turn down one very persistant ex-friend who decided she just HAD to have him. Then came the betrayal, the lies, the confusion, the tears, and the loneliness...the depression that feels like it's knawing at you from the inside out. Feelings of worthlessness, of being unattractive, "old", and not enough. The pain almost killed me, literally. The rage and hate that came after finding out the truth. The bitterness that still exists.

    We, after 7.5 years, broke up for good. I haven't seen him for almost 10 months. He has written me two letters in the last two weeks. I haven't responded. He says he still has very strong feelings for me, and wants to at least have some communication. It dredged up all the old feelings, good and bad. I miss watching him sleep. I miss us laughing at the same time, to everything on t.v. I miss how he used to look at me when I'd get up to sing live music. I miss the times, in bed, when we held eachother so tight, it's like we just couldn't get close enough. I miss the incomparable, uninhibited sex. I miss sitting on the porch with him, early in the morning, drinking coffee and talking about plans for landscaping the yard. I miss his smell...I loved his scent. I used to smell his clothes when I picked them up to wash them. He used to sniff my hair and neck deeply. I could go on and on.

    The pain of knowing we can't be together, because he's not a good enough man for me, is too much. I could have done without this pain. I can't love anyone else...I can't move on. I try to like other people, but nothing comes close. I go through my days, trying to be positive, trying to be hopeful, but he still invades my dreams. Sometimes I dream that we're back together, and in my dream, we're holding eachother and we're both so happy. Then I wake up. I sigh, I put my pants on, one leg at a time, and do what I have to to get through my day.

    I'll never be with a younger man again. I know a lot of our issues may or may not have been about age, but I'm thinking it was more age than not. The sad thing is, I'll never give my heart away so completely again either.
    Last edited by whiterose; 08-31-2007 at 10:21 PM. Reason: language
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  6. #36
    Ariadne Guest
    I think the points raised by Special K about younger men are pretty much spot on, but I don't think they are like that just because they are younger men.

    Given the nature of this board, women who post here are for the most part going to be over 30. Also it's very much likely they are accostomed to previous relationships, have made a few mistakes.

    I met my husband when I was 21. He was 18, the so called "VYM" age.

    He was not in any way the wonderful, caring attentive person Special K describes. Well he was caring and attentive to an extent, but not at all romantic with it. It was mostly in giving gifts and with sex. He was bossy and overbearing on the flip side. He would never be romantic without expecting sex later. So he would not be romantic while we were out, because there wasn't a bed there. It made me terribly unhappy, but I went with it because it was clear he cared for me, and I was insecure and from an unhappy home.

    I've suffered years of being put down by this misogynist and I've grown enough to recognise that I need a caring, sweet guy. Ironically I used to be attracted to such people in my teens. They were always very geeky. My first boyfriend was very much like my new boyfriend, but we seperated when I moved away.

    I made the mistake of equating "geeky guy" with "sweet, gentle guy" and ended up with my husband, a man who would boss me around and verbally abuse me at every given opportunity.

    What I wanted all along was my current boyfriend and I've finally grown up enough to recognise this in a man, and not tolerate glaring faults any longer. These are the ideal men who often fall by the wayside because young girls can't recognise these qualities and instead pick men who seem stronger and more confident, but this ends up being arrogance.

    I just don't know. All I know is I've always adored men like my boyfriend, in fact the friends I've kept through the years have been a lot like him.

  7. #37
    rubygurl Guest
    Gosh, when I read Special K's 6 "Most Amazing Things" about a VYM, I felt I couldn't have explained it any better!! I'll never ever forget those precious, luscious moments of my life!!

    I also related to the part about some VYM going through the "confused" stage in life, trying to find themselves, and:

    especially if you were their first significant "adult relationship" and/or they were in their teens when you got together. Many need to stretch on their own to gain autonomy down the road, and that can be heartbreaking for both of you since he may still profess his love, but he just needs to figure things out on his own.
    This is what happened with me and my ex-YM, he wasn't very young, 25, but he was a late bloomer and I was his first "adult" relationship so letting him go to find himself was indeed heartbreaking, but necessary.

    Polly, by the time I got to the end of your post, there were tears streaming down my face. I could have written so much of what you wrote. I FELT your feelings as I read them because they are my own! 9 months post-breakup I still can't have another relationship because every guy I meet or date just doesn't compare - not because of them, but because I'm just not over him...yet. So I've given up on dating for now, and maybe one day - poof! - I'll be ready...maybe not. What else can one do? Sometimes fairy tales don't have happy endings, but fairy tales are ALWAYS more magical and beautiful than real life, IMHO ! When I think about those special moments with my ex-YM, I feel that familiar twinge in my heart from missing him, and my eyes start to well up - but now I also have a grin on my face because it was just so beautiful. I may not have him anymore, but I will always have that gift he gave me...and that's more than some people get in a lifetime.

  8. #38
    jellybean400 Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by rubygurl View Post

    Polly, by the time I got to the end of your post, there were tears streaming down my face. I could have written so much of what you wrote. I FELT your feelings as I read them because they are my own!
    I agree.

    So beautifully written, and i could feel everything. I know that wont make you feel better, but i have had that feeling of loss, loving someone so much, and then missing them so much, and hurting so GD bad that you dont want to go on, and you dont ever want to love again.

    And my ex-YM is always wanting to stay in contact...i try, and i cant. I just cant do it; at least i've tried. I almost slept with him again...until i thought "who the F- am i kidding??"

    I wish you the best, and i'm sorry you had to go thru that, and that youre still going thru it. But remember, you dont need him to love you, or anyone else to. Only you.

    I now have a VYM "friend," i call him my 'buddy,' but we'd both like to try and see if there's more. He's LD, and i'm just scared to death of the whole thing, because i know i'll fall for him, and i feel like hes wayyy too young. I know that's a bad thing to say on this site, but i just do. I dont want to get hurt, and hes so sweet, and nice, and kind, and cool...

    I'm going to "let" myself go and have one visit with him. I figure if i dont, then i'll never know. But it really is ALL terrifying anymore.

  9. #39
    MisKryptonite Guest
    My heart goes out to all of you who are hurt... I am still on the "ride" for now, but have long thought about it ending just as you have described. I don't want to say that it's not possible to last forever, because there are those who will survive against all odds...but most of us will end up as you've so sadly described. That was a huge part of my decision to enter into this relationship in the first place. I didn't want to do that again, for fear this time I might NOT survive it...after all, how much can the heart actually take?
    I still think about this now, even being along for the ride...but I've come to the conclusion that it would hurt just as much to end it now as it will later on, but if I let fear of the devistation take control, I will never know how it was supposed to end or if it was going to. That's just cheating myself.

  10. #40
    Belisama's Avatar
    Belisama is offline I love being a redhead!
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    Quote Originally Posted by special K View Post
    It IS ABSOLUTELY nice that some are still together (I just counted only ~6 from this thread with vym 18-21 at first, but I've been wrong before!).
    I only counted 6 from this thread, too but hey, out of the folks who still post here regularly, that's a pretty heavy majority!

    Also, now that I've posted to this thread, that number can be upped to 7 (even though Tim isn't a VYM any more, he was when this post was started and had I known ::: glare ::: I'd have posted back then! So yes. We count for the purposes of this thread!

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