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Thread: The Cardinal Rules to VYM Relationships

  1. #61
    bubbleee Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by Bella
    you can't make excuses for lousy behaviour by saying he's just young. Bad treatment is bad treatment no matter what age someone is

    You have the right to be treated just as well as you'd expect to be treated by someone your own age.

    You have the right to be treated, like he'd expect to treat someone HIS own age.

    I see soooo often women come here and, "well, I let things slide, he's young." whether it's cheating, drinking, borrowing money, whatever. If someone his own age wouldn't put up with it, neither should you.

    I'd hope by this age, women would have enough sense to expect respect and tenderness, not somehow belittle themselves into thinking they deserve ill treatment.
    In light of some recent questions here about some VYM, I thought I'd reiterate this post made by Bella.

    Belitting another person, although a sign of insecurity, is NEVER acceptable in a relationship IMHO. The minute somebody tries to belittle me, whoever they are, get a boundary drawn immediately.

    Men treat women they way they do at times because we allow it, pure and simple. Being young is no excuse, ever for continually treating someone with disrepect.

  2. #62
    findthemagic Guest

    i just found this thread - good stuff, and thanks all!

    Just read this whole thread, and appreciate all the thoughtful comments and perspectives, especially about the money issues. My YM is 22, and we have been seeing each other almost 2 years. (26 year age gap) I made some of the money mistakes in the first year, and got taken for a ride. Now, a very different YM feels pretty embarrassed about his past behavior, and has almost gone to the opposite extreme, not wanting to take help from me even when it really does make sense, or he deserves it because of sacrifices he has made for me. But I am not protesting, because I know it is his way of making amends, and also mending his own self esteem, in some way.

    But I have wondered about the money issue. He has no career as of yet, and also lives in another country and didn't/doesn't have the opportunities I had at his age. Yet he has alot of talent, and I know that he would find his way, with me or without me. I remember reading somewhere, maybe here, that often this issue of the disparity in career status is resolved by both going into business together. As partners, the issue of being in different rungs on the ladder dissolves. I was relieved to read this, because from the beginning, this was my idea anyway. He is the first romantic partner I have had whom I would really like to be with 24/7 and don't think it would drive me bonkers. That has been my pattern when I visit his country, and recently we spent a month pretty much 24/7 and we both find it so easy. At the end, we cautiously approached the idea of working together again, and are feeling our way now, about what things he is doing for me just to be nice, and what things he should be paid for. As I said, he is very cautious now about taking money, but I know it will get easier as the businesses take off.

    I agree that it will even out in the end. I didn't know his age when we met, but had the oddest, almost supernatural experience. When we had our first private conversation, it was like I saw laid out before us the whole trajectory of our lives. (this was a virtual stranger, mind you!) What I saw was that I would come to his country and invest (didn't know then where the funds would come from) and that he would help me run the businesses as they got more and more successful, like an assistant manager, almost, and then when he was older, in his 40s, he would be making some major career moves, and become more high profile, and that I would then fade into the background more, and essentially shadow and support him in building his career. I actually shared this view with him a few months after we started dating, and i think it kept him going, because he felt very insecure about the disparity in our levels of life success. it helps to see the big picture, and there is one. I also like the idea of being able to kick back just when he reaches the age of wanting to aggressively push ahead. I think there are alot of things that work with these age gaps. (Just wish I could stop the skin aging process!!)

    I think if I had a cardinal rule, it would be Have faith in your partner, and have faith in the relationship. Doubts can be really toxic, whereas friendly support and understanding in the face of mistakes or ignorance can be so healing and confidence building. I find that he tends to give me what I expect. He has acted his most immature when he was faced with my negative projections on him, such as fears or expectations that he was likely to be immature, or doubting his veracity, out of my own insecurity. Sometimes fear is nothing more than that -- my own projection, with no basis in reality.

    So thanks again for the posts, all. I will continue to ponder the material I read here.
    Last edited by findthemagic; 10-01-2006 at 03:16 AM. Reason: correct bolding

  3. #63
    special K's Avatar
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    Here's a link to a great thread started by Kristin about the importance of both people in an AGR being in similar "lifestages" with similar experiences gained during their time on earth. I think it applies really well for all AGR's including those with very young people....

    OW/YM Dynamics
    Last edited by special K; 10-04-2006 at 06:24 PM. Reason: to clarify the intention of the last sentence ...no mutinies, please ;-)
    "What the caterpillar sees as the end of the world, the butterfly calls wings."

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by special K
    importance of both people in an AGR being in similar "lifestages" with similar experiences gained during their time on earth.
    Hmmm.....kinda different take on what I was saying, actually.

    I think what I was really trying to say is that you have to be ready for it and fit each other's expectations ie the moon/stars/planets having to align.

    I think part of the point of my thread, though, is that there ARE NO "CARDINAL RULES."

    Every relationship has so many different variables that what works for one couple may very well fail for another.

    Some "advice" is good - like not letting youth be an excuse for bad behavior - but other things just don't apply to all relationships.

    For example, finances. Yes there is a greater chance that you may be better off financially, but that doesn't mean that every YM will take advantage of that. Like many women here, I did help Jeremy get on his feet - but he paid me back every cent with every paycheck. And now, he is the only obsticle between my family and living on the street. Not all YM (or men in general) are going to do that.

    So, not all AGRs are created equal.

    My point is, you just can't ignore whether or not you are both in the "right" place to handle the AGR. Either he needs to be at the point that he is ready to step up and be a man, in a mature relationship, with all that entails with YOU in your situation, or you need to be able to step back or be in a place that allows for a guy who is still learning the ropes and may struggle, as we all did at some point.

    If one or the both of you is not there, at the right place at the right time, it just won't work.

    It has nothing to do with the size of the gap nor the age of the man.
    Last edited by Kristin; 10-03-2006 at 03:38 PM.

  5. #65
    marcy Guest
    *three cheers for Kristin*

    I completely agree!

  6. #66
    special K's Avatar
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    [B]A VYM will act just like just like you did at that age. He will NOT always resolve it they way you did. And you have no right to be judgemental or impatient about that. Our mistakes can be our greatest tools in maturing.[/B]
    That one is a doozy for me. There are things I just know from having been there and I forget he hasn't had all those things happen yet. Does my experience make me right? Probably not about 1/2 the time. It's nice to see he can view something in a different light. I have to learn to bite my tongue until it bleeds sometimes.
    I hear ya, AngelAngel...and I agree 100% . Where we are in life's journey including the experiences we gain as the days/months/years go by, and learning from the mistakes we make along the way, all contribute to our maturity and readiness for ANY relationship down the road (whether age gap or same-age), as well as choices we make in life in general.

    I've done some of that tongue-biting in my time too BUT, in the end, I always love it when I learn something I never knew, or am led to see something in a different light by my YM.
    Last edited by special K; 10-04-2006 at 06:31 PM.
    "What the caterpillar sees as the end of the world, the butterfly calls wings."

  7. #67
    special K's Avatar
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    Kristin... I totally get your point. I think that there were a lot of good insights on your thread in general that would certainly apply to AGR's with vym...that's why I posted the link.

    As you say...being at the right place (lifestage) at the right time in both partner's lives is what either makes or breaks ANY relationship. I think that includes maturity level (which we reach at different ages), and also things like being congruent on we are in our own spiritual paths,etc.
    Last edited by special K; 10-04-2006 at 06:29 PM.
    "What the caterpillar sees as the end of the world, the butterfly calls wings."

  8. #68
    Daniel Guest
    I'd like to add one. Establish well defined boundaries. Yes, that is important in any relationship, but when there is an age gap, it is important for the benefit of the older partner, especially if the older partner is a lady, and even more when the younger partner is a vym.

    An OW/YM relationship is always more challenging to the lady; society is not as accepting and society places greater emphasis on youth in regards to women than it does to men. A YM or a VYM will likely have trouble understanding this. Without well defined boundaries, any relationship will have difficulty. In a relationship that society is ambivalent about, good boundaries and communication are absolutely essential, as failure in this area will only confirm the oppinions of detractors.

    Also, as the older partner, there will be things that you will need boundaries on and he may not understand why simply because he hasn't been where you are. Rather than you trying to make him understand (assuming he's trying but just cannot get the perspective), he simply needs to respect your feelings on the matter. This will go a long way towards keeping the relationship from having rough spots in those areas.

    Regarding money, that boundary must be carved in stone and stuck to. If he cannot support himself and is young enough that he will likely outlive you, helping him financially when he asks will not help him get prepared for when you are no longer there. When people have financial support, they also tend to lose ambition, and therefore, the drive to do better professionally. This will also damage the relationship, because you will feel like you've taken on raising a child rather than having a young lover.

    Remember that you are most likely financially established moreso than a VYM. This is part of what gives you your perspective. It is a perspective that he can only understand once he's earned it himself. Be his cheerleader, his encouragement, and maybe help him out once in a while with small stuff the way that people do with their S.O. (don't let it be a one way street), but don't let him use you for his financial support.

    Milady has offered me financial help in the past. I have turned her down every time. I pay for dates more often than not. I don't want her to feel like she's dating a kid. This has gone a long way in reducing some of the age gap anxiety that she has.

    Well, I'm starting to ramble. Better quit now.

    DanE

  9. #69
    special K's Avatar
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    Regarding money, that boundary must be carved in stone and stuck to. If he cannot support himself and is young enough that he will likely outlive you, helping him financially when he asks will not help him get prepared for when you are no longer there. When people have financial support, they also tend to lose ambition, and therefore, the drive to do better professionally. This will also damage the relationship, because you will feel like you've taken on raising a child rather than having a young lover.

    Remember that you are most likely financially established moreso than a VYM. This is part of what gives you your perspective. It is a perspective that he can only understand once he's earned it himself. Be his cheerleader, his encouragement, and maybe help him out once in a while with small stuff the way that people do with their S.O. (don't let it be a one way street), but don't let him use you for his financial support.
    I agree 1001%, Dan...and coming from your perspective as a ym, it just lends more credibility to the discussion of the absolute neccessity of the "money boundary". Well put...and thank you for saying it better than I could !

    BRAVO!
    "What the caterpillar sees as the end of the world, the butterfly calls wings."

  10. #70
    BrownEyedGirl Guest
    My cardinal rule:

    He must love me passionately and be my best friend. That's all. That's the rule. If this wasn't the most amazing relationship ever for me it wouldn't be worth it.

  11. #71
    Enigma Guest

    Advise Please

    Hi Everybody

    I am an online girlfriend with a YM, and we have been together for 3.5 months. We met on an online game and the relationship has developed online. Recently he has surprised me by telling me that he will be coming to visit me and spending Christmas eve with me. This will be our 1st meeting. He is flying down from Europe to Singapore and that is quite a distance.

    He has told me that what he loves about me is that he can trust me 100% without worrying about me going for another guy due to money issues as his previous young girlfriends has. If someone better looking or has more money, they would leave him for the other guy. But like previous threads or posts I have read, I have the same concerns with our age difference. This is a first OW/YM relationship I am going into.

    Most of the contributions I have read are from America, Europe etc. I'm Asian and he is too although he was brought up in Europe and is currently staying there. I'm also afraid of what my parents would think (they would freak out) as I'm from a traditional family and am still staying with my parents. I'm 39 and he is 19. My ex was 43 but he fooled around alot and I still have fears on that issue.

    Is there any advise you could give me on the topics of discussions that I should have with him on my concerns of age and money.

    I've read on one post, with regards to online gaming with your online boyfriend then before becoming your husband. Does how a person play online tell much about a character of a peron in his real life? Cause in-game, my YM spends alot of money and sometimes borrows in-game money but he has never asked me to loan him any in real life. Please need urgent advise on this particular paragraph of thought.

    As my boyfriend will be flying down this month and in about a week when I will meet him, I want to be mentally prepared. I'm both excited and nervous and he has conveyed the same sentiments.

    Help please all who are in a marriage or have a successful OW/YM relationship. I'm just on yellow alert now. Need help before it becomes on red alert.

  12. #72
    marcy Guest
    I am in a successful marriage with a ym. I am 38 and my husband is 21. We have been together since he was 18... so far so good

  13. #73
    badgerkat Guest

    Just starting out

    Well, here I am with my first post, and glad I am to have found this site. It's been four weeks of confusion, fear, and joy with my YM--I turned 49 last week and he is 26. I'm struggling with all the concerns you've voiced, plus one of compatibility--he and I are very different in cultural perspectives as well. I'm a college professor and he's a contractor; I can't drive a nail and he can't sit through a play. Right now, all I know is that we are very much drawn to one another and he goes out of his way to spend time with me. Still, I am so concerned about our age difference--I'm used to thinking about men his age as off-limits (students), He has nothing to do with the place I teach or the people I work with, so that isn't a problem, but years of thinking of twenty-somethings as "kids" is making my foray into OW/YM life very taxing. Any thoughts?

  14. #74
    bubbleee Guest
    Badgerkat,

    There's plenty of women on here with large gaps. I'm in my 50's and my boyfriend is in his early 20's. We've enjoyed each other's company for about 2 years now. I'm a city girl, and he's a country boy.

    Anybody over the age of 18 is not legally a "kid". They can quit school (if they are still in HS), get married, join the military, what have you, without a parental signature. So maybe you should start with trying to stop thinking of college students as kids, and as young adults.

    Secondly, if you are enjoying your time with this young man, then just enjoy it and see where things go. People are really just people and not a total number of years you know.

    P.S. Welcome to the forum!

  15. #75
    Rozie Guest
    Badgerkat, as long as you think of a 26 year old as a kid, you are going to have troubles with an AG relationship. One thing that might be helpful is to remember where you were in life at 26. I had completed two bachelors degrees, was married and contemplating a having a baby and working full time as a nurse. That's not a kid.

    I do understand how you profession impacts on your view, but a 26 year old student is not a kid either. I am now a pediatrician so I have a similar dilemma; my concern is more that I don't want people believing I would have any interest in their adolescent sons, because I am dating a much younger man. Silly, I know. I was talking to another pediatrician friend of mine the other day and mentioned I was spending Christmas in Florida. She asked me "With the boy?" I responded tartly, "With the young man, yes, but he's NOT a boy. He's your oldest son's age." She laughed and agreed, her oldest son is a man...an OLD man. It was the perfect illustration of how some people are mature beyond their years. Would I date other 28 year olds? Probably not....I just happened to fall in love with THIS man...dang it...he's only 28!

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